Denon SC5000 Prime

[Tellor01]

Aren't the Xone DB faders kind of like that, though?

With my DB4 made in UK seriously no. Not feel weird or cheap.

If you don't have Pioneers to compare, try the demos for Deckadance 2.0 and Torq 2.0 to see what I'm talking about. So I think there's hope we're not stuck with the comparatively dark, processed, mushy coloration on the SC5000.

yesterday, i try to compare with Torq and my Xone DB4 for the soundcard, the sound are lot better in SC5000 than the software Torq especially with lossless format and good mastering (24bits 48khz)

[Reticuli]

With my DB4 made in UK seriously no. Not feel weird or cheap.



yesterday, i try to compare with Torq and my Xone DB4 for the soundcard, the sound are lot better in SC5000 than the software Torq especially with lossless format and good mastering (24bits 48khz)

Torq 2.0 has lousy sound. The SC5000 is not that bad, but it's closer to that kind of sound than it should be. Warmed up, low-pass filtered, a little compressed, and a bit mushy. Works with some stuff that needs some warming and compression like old funk. Now try Deckadance 2.0 demo. Not talking about with pitch way away from zero and keylock on. DB4 as soundcard for the software and SC5000 going digitally into DB4. Try your Pioneers, too. The SC5000 is definitely a darker, mushier sound than DD2.0 and the Pioneers... closer to what Torq 2.0's doing. I guess one solution would be to normalize all your tracks before playing on the SC5000 to -6dBVU and use it with really bright, lean sound systems and maybe even ruthlessly transparent mixers like the MP2015.

[SlayForMoney]

Is there a way to have Engine Prime simply create a database of an entire pre-existing drive so files can be searched for at least (better than nothing), even if I must wait 20-30 seconds for each track to analyze on load?

You don't need to analyze all 70k of files. Deselect "analyze at import" and then only analyze files that are in crates/playlists. You get a sub-2.4GB library data file and yet the whole collection is searchable. Thanks to players analyzing the songs themselves, even if you need and load a song that's not in a crate/playlist you will get waveform/key/metadata in 20-30sec.

Read. Again.

A 20-30 second delay before setting the cue is not acceptable. No one in their right mind who knows DJing would say it is. You're not explicitly saying that, but you're kinda dancing around the issue like it's no big deal.

I wasn't saying anything about the time it takes to analyze a song and use the cue, especially since it is something that was explicitly said to be fixed in a future firmware. If you're the kind of DJ that mixes a new song every 60sec then I guess that is a big deal to YOU currently. Also means I hope to never have to hear your ADD mixing.

Since you really like to talk to yourself and just recycle your own opinions through every post I will put you on mute/block.

[Reticuli]

Read. Again.



I wasn't saying anything about the time it takes to analyze a song and use the cue, especially since it is something that was explicitly said to be fixed in a future firmware. If you're the kind of DJ that mixes a new song every 60sec then I guess that is a big deal to YOU currently. Also means I hope to never have to hear your ADD mixing.

Since you really like to talk to yourself and just recycle your own opinions through every post I will put you on mute/block.

It does not matter that I do not have any crates/playlists?

I don't mix a new track ever 60 seconds, but sometimes I do find a track with less than 60 seconds remaining.

[SlayForMoney]

I didnt feel comfortable testing the crossfader more than a couple basic scratches (due to it being someone else's mixer and me not wanting to buy them a new crossfader cause I broke the stem), but it feels very similar to the old djm600 crossfader (which would bend and break if you put to much pressure on it).

It's a tried and tested model of crossfader called Flex Fader, back from X1500S model. Very durable, precise and tension adjust is great (shame you have to pull out the fader on X1800 to adjust it). Only downsides are the metal stoppers (noisy as frack) and it's a contact fader so it will eventually wear out.

[Reticuli]

Denon editing.JPG

This is really starting to piss me off. This is just the most recent. By the way, the thread was on the X1800 effects quality and I basically can't argue if it's good or not, but the baseline in to out fidelity seems comparable to Pioneer and this is all update-able firmware. Instead they're using me to argue that the effects aren't as bad as the others in the thread are claiming. Not cool. In other instances, they've removed identifiers that individually direct responses to others on a thread such that after the edit you can't tell what I'm talking about, and even gotten rid of paragraph spacing so that it's one big block of text and then the same mods complain that I'm rudely posting long blocks of text.

[Reticuli]

The X1800 has studio quality sound from the USB to USB throughput. Its DSP processing appears to be quite transparent with no effects On and does fairly predictable alteration of test waveforms with the EQ in use.

The SC5000 is very different. I tried both the two units with original firmware and the third unit I have with v1.0.3 with no differences in results. Material was sent from the SC5000 digitally to the relatively transparent X1800, then through USB back to the computer at 24/96. Using test waveforms and audio analysis tracks in WAV format at both 16 44.1 and 24 96 on the SC5000, I got the following with pitch at zero unless I say otherwise:

Bottom of frequency response is down 1 to 2dB at 20hz for keylock on or off and both formats.

Response -6dB down by 16khz on all.

Both test signal bitrate/sample rates and keylock On or Off showed a 30khz harmonic spike in frequency response when there isn't even content present in the original signal there.

Response showed a nearly -4dB notch at about 410hz with keylock On.

10% IMD + Noise in RMAA.

At pitch above zero on 16/44.1 or on 24/96 at any pitch, impulse response is not consistent amplitude and oscillates from only slightly squashed to very squashed & damped and then goes back up with periodicity.

There's a little leading edge transient exaggeration on square waves and other waveforms show only a little noise with keylock off, more so with keylock On even at zero pitch.

With extreme negative pitch with keylock on for a significant time or repeated slow braking with keylock on, it was possible to cause the SC5000 audio processing to malfunction and completely mutilate the test waveform until either the track was stopped & started without braking or keylock was disabled/enabled. Hitting play after slow braking or even just going back to zero pitch after extreme negative pitch with keylock On did not resolve the processing malfunction.

Hopefully the frequency response can be flattened, compression turned off using a -6dB pad instead or 32bit float processing, the keylock braking audio processing malfunction and the oscillation of the impulses can both be eliminated, and the sound quality can be improved overall, especially with something at least approaching bit perfect at zero pitch like on the Pioneers. That said, when the keylock isn't going haywire, it's quite impressive at negative pitches at 16/44.1.

[Reticuli]

I have not tested VBR on the SC5000 yet.

Here is a link to the Gemini post for comparison:

http://forum.djtechtools.com/showthr...l=1#post758842

[Reticuli]

On a positive note, if they never do make the frequency response flat, maybe the SC5000 response will match well with many MM and MI phono cartridges. It does slightly remind me of the Vestax CDX-05 vinyl filter mode. I suppose that's glass half full. The malfunctions and outright defects in the audio processing right now definitely need to go, and this warmed up low pass filter and compression thing ought to at least be optional. I mean, I've got flat MM and MI carts and even HOMC carts I've DJ'ed with.

[the_bastet]

It's a tried and tested model of crossfader called Flex Fader, back from X1500S model. Very durable, precise and tension adjust is great (shame you have to pull out the fader on X1800 to adjust it). Only downsides are the metal stoppers (noisy as frack) and it's a contact fader so it will eventually wear out.

Nice. I have a Flex Fader in my DNX1100. Didnt feel the same. Updated materials/build maybe?