Input from Pro Audio specialists to the DJ community....?

[PIGLET]

I just read the 'digital vs analogue mixing' post which was sited as one of the most popular posts in DjTechtools.

I felt compelled to reply and made quite an extensive response which some may and some may not agree with.

However it made me consider another global aspect that I think Ean and others at DJTechtools might consider.

As I said in the post - I am a music producer and have been concentrating on building my studio and focussing on researching pro audio technology as it exists in the modern recording studio. Reading up a lot on digital audio, sample rates, analogue equiptment and the analogue vs digital debate in recording studios. I started out DJing about 10 years ago using 1200s. I have taken a break whilst focussing on production and come back to it in the digital format.

After being embroiled in the pro audio sphere for a while and returning to the DJ market - I cant help but feel there is a lot that could be gained from having access of some audio professionals in a reviewer or consultant basis.
DJ Techtools is a great spot - great bunch of guys - great info and community on DJ matters. However - as much as you guys know about DJ products and techniques - there are a whole set of higher levels of audio understanding and knowledge in the Pro Audio field. This is because it is huge business for pro recording studios - it is essential for them to have the best quality sound possible. I think its somewhat of a shame that so much money gets spent in this area - only to have many DJs not being exposed to correct info and therefore degrading this money and effort - often through no fault of their own...or purchasing equipment that if they had the right knowledge they would not buy...

I have noticed that DJ goods manufacturers in their marketing do appear to spread or subtly manipulate concepts that are taken on board by the DJ community. I felt this apparent in the 'analogue vs digital mixing' thread.

However - this isnt completely sinister. Most DJ gear is very much fit for purpose usable and I dont want to make DJs feel bad about using $200 interfaces and mp3s.

However for those DJs who take things really seriously and have some extra budget - there are definitely things to be learned from the Pro Audio community. The Pro Audio community have serious big budgets for research into digital and analogue audio - as they are the guys where it starts from. The best quality audio is their business.
I think it would empower DJs around here to have a really clear understanding about the basics of digital audio and how it differs from analogue, plus a lot of other info that could de-bunk some of the marketing guff that I read from manufacturers. I also think this is important because some may argue that the quality of music (in terms of sound quality) is reducing because of cheap tools available and lack of education about how to use them. For example - digital audio should NEVER be clipped and limiters should generally be avoided if you want to preserve the quality of your music.
The latter part of the Analogue vs Digital mixing thread indicated some important ideas that dont often get talked about in the DJ community - the comments from Paul Hughes and George Peterson.

I wonder - would it be possible to have some contributors from the Pro Audio engineer field make comments and advise the DJ arena? I think people would learn a lot...and some people who wanted to could seriously improve the quality of their work...

[belchman]

That would be really interesting actually! Audio leveling and the whole clipping thing is one thing which I think can really separate a good quality live mix and a crap one. I try my best just through playing around, but it would be really good to have a pro opinion on that kinda thing just to get some tips in that sphere.

Good plan that man

[pier]

I agree, a simple knowledge on how audio works (analog and digital) would benefit every dj on the planet.

I'm tired of seing deaf djs working with clipped signals at monstruous pressure levels...

I think this is the basic stuff every dj should know:
- how analog signals work (noise, dynamic range, impedance, etc)
- how digital audio signals work (bits, sampling frequency, clocks, jitter, etc.)
- AD/DA conversion
- clipping (knowing how to clip in analog, and knowing why you must never ever clip in digital)
- dynamic range/signal to noise ratio (or why you need a high gain signal without clipping)
- what is a limiter/compressor
- Midi

[belchman]

@pier - i agree, since i don't fully understand half of those things!

Indeed, there is a mobile DJ who is a regular at my school for the crappy socials we have (either when i'm busy, can't be arsed to DJ, or don't organise them!) and he is actually not too bad at mixing his music - but everything blasts into the red, and he shouts into this horrible tinny, distorted, and very loud mic - which ruins everything for me. Shame really!

[Lantau]

but everything blasts into the red

I don't get why anyone* does that...

I'd definitely be interested in finding out more, as I've read about how limiters and suchlike work but I don't really understand their effects, especially with regard to audio quality. Plus the budding audiophile in me would like to know how DJing links up with what comes out of the speakers

* I can imagine why some people used to do it on certain mixers back in the day

[belchman]

hehe back in the day! love it..

Yeah my shitty behringer DJM 800 rip off (don't get one by the way) tells me off for even thinking about going into the red - if it even just clips a teeny weeny bit it yells at me in really loud white noise! Silly thing..

[charo]

to the best of my knowledge anyone interested in writing articles for djtechtools is welcome to contact them and there is that possibility.

i don't think there is some conspiracy at the legions of djtechtools that calls for holding its forum masses in darkness, if you have issues with the article, use the comments or take them to point here.

[djtimmmy]

+1 on the thread.

I see so many places that take sound quality for granted. dj's running things in the red all the time and almost to the point they are looking for that clip lights on the amp to be on all the time.... for some of these guys it's like a right of passage

Please!!!.


All the places where I have to provide everything I run through a 15band dbx eq and take the time to listen to the room acoustics before the crowd shows up... Then run through a dbx compressor to level out the mix. and smooth off the peaks. compressors / limiters can be invaluable tools IF USED PROPERLY...


Bass should be punchy, clean, undistorted.... Highs should be crisp, clean and not honky. and mids should not sound muddy

hate to say it im anal when it comes to sound quality... its the first thing I notice when I step into a club....


There is nothing worse then the sound 10,000 watts pushing ten 18" subs and all bottoming out and slapping the coil off the back of the magnet

[Damien1138]

OK, what about pioneer mixers that have liek 4 bars of red? Should i not be going to 3 and try to keep green the whole way through? I'm not noticing any clipping unless im consistently at top... Rane are easier to read imo

[djhipnotikk]

I also think this is the basic stuff every dj should know:
- how analog signals work (noise, dynamic range, impedance, etc)
- how digital audio signals work (bits, sampling frequency, clocks, jitter, etc.)
- AD/DA conversion
- clipping (knowing how to clip in analog, and knowing why you must never ever clip in digital)
- dynamic range/signal to noise ratio (or why you need a high gain signal without clipping)
- what is a limiter/compressor
- Midi

shitty behringer DJM 800 rip off

please tell me you're not talking about the ddm4000 they look so sweet..