S4 - Fx tricks in midi mode (new user video)

[Yul]

The led behaviour on the sample play buttons were made like that:
each one is a beat phase monitor output, I've just divided the range in 4 for a group of four buttons (and reverse the order of the settings for the other group:
1st setting -0.3; -0.3
2nd: -0.1; -0.1
3rd: 0.1; 0.1
4th : 0.3;0.3
midi range is still 0 to 127

I've duplicated for each button 4 times the function, each one assigned to one of the 4 decks (so that's 4 output functions to create per led). I did it that way because of the limitations of the beat phase monitor itself (doesn't work if your track is within a loop under 1 beat) or because of the assignment itself (ie doesn't work if your track isn't playing). Duplicating the function for each deck maximise the chances the leds will blink in any given time.

As Photojojo mentioned it can be easily done using a volume output command instead (probably the master level and you divide the range between the buttons) and it may be a better choice actually (because you don't have to duplicate like I did the beat phase monitor).



Issues I met speaking of leds:
- when switching to midi mode the led states may or may not be updated (when going from native to midi). That sucks a lot, even by adding some send monitor state commands you can't really trust what you see (as you may want to map some critical controls like FX units assignments and have led feedback for that).
- in midi mode, the S4 can't handle the led feedback I've created in the first place. Originally, all three ranges of buttons for a deck layer were blinking in turn. Then when I did the same for the other layer, suddenly some leds started to not be updated anymore. I checked everything. I don't know if I 'overloaded' the capacity of the S4 by using beat phase monitor commands so many times but after 10 buttons mapped, then I realised the following leds didn't work properly). It happened whatever the buttons I mapped and in what order, after several, everything messes. I don't really know what to think about that.
- even if I can do some tricks with midi mapping, it seems I have issues with simple commands now when it comes to the S4. I've only opened the controller editor for the first time recently, changed the messages accordingly but for some buttons it seems I'm not able to map a simple on/off led output. Weird.

[Yul]

Effects chosen for the buttons

I'm using Fx units in pairs so units 1&3 are either for decks a&c or both, units 2&4 for decks b&d. The 8 buttons (HT & samples) 'usually' control the 1st or 2nd unit depending on which side you're working on, the 'sync', 'cue' & 'play' buttons 'generally' control the 3 & 4 units likewise.

* slicer + either delay, reverb or f92lfo
* gater + either delay, flanger or peak filter
* either formant filter, peak filter or phaser pulse + T3delay
* beatmasher (50% d/w) + either delay, iceverb, or "freeze"
* beatmasher (100% d/w) + either F92lfo or reverse grain + either delay or iceverb
* beatmasher, transpose, gater + either t3reverb or delay
* beatmasher, filter, flanger pulse + either delay, flanger or freeze
* reverb, lofi, beatmasher + either delay, gater or freeze

It's not very well thought out, especially the choices of FX that colour the first group. Some of the above are also a bit redundant with my native settings.

Issues I met:
none really for the mapping, when you switch to midi mode all your controls are free, you can do whatever you like, it's a virgin blueprint so you don't have to create fancy modifiers tricks (unless you want to). I just mapped critical controls (volume faders+ led, EQ, cross fader, play/stop, etc... ) and I used the In and Out buttons to assign the FX units so I have everything close. It should also replicate the loop recorder (something I didn't do) as that could add a real value to the system.

But it is really easy to do. Really. As mentioned all controls are free of any command so you can get crazy with what you want and can do. Start with something simple like the slicer in advanced mode to play with it with buttons:

* configure the buttons accordingly in the controller editor (usually to a note/gate type).
1/Create something simple to call your slicer with desired settings - usually a shift + a button (that's your 'FX preset')
2/Create a way of assigning your FX unit(s) - a simple on/off toggling command
3/Map to a button all the FX settings you want and engage the FX(s) with an 'effect(s) on' function on the button set to 'hold'.
4/Done, repeat step 3 for another button
5/ have fun
Note: that's a simple caricature.

Good news is if you want to create a juggle mode, the faders (at least the pitch fader I used) are sending much more precisely info back to the software it seems (unlike some previous units I had so putting in place a system was a bit unreliable). Create a modifier for your fader and then create your effects settings to happen at the chosen states of your modifier.

It took me 5 full nights to map everything - but I went a bit complex - as a test only to check if that would suit me (going 'native' to 'midi'). I don't intend to dwelve into it for the time being, I'm just fed up. Gosh, the controller manager is so user UNFRIENDLY. Wouldn't it be so hard to create at least a ctrl+ paste something to be able to fill in several lines at the same time? It's currently idiotic.
So no tsi to pass around (by the way you'll have to use the controller editor too) as I would have to work on it more to tidy it (I'm going to puke if I have to set up another function or try to find back what I did and where) and eventually to give some kind of follow up (and I prefer to pass my 'free time' listening or playing with music, you'll excuse me). I really prefer to discuss and exchange ideas, or answer - if I can- direct questions (depends: the other day someone asked me how to apply an effect on a channel..are you kidding me??? RTFM)

In the end:
I think it is a workaround and should be taken like that. Even if I don't like the idea as that defeats the concept of an all-in-one unit , an additional controller may still be the best choice. That's what I may do in the future and I'm thinking about something with a jogwheel, some faders and buttons and turn that into an FX machine. Or a midi fighter (those kits are sexy. Me. Want. One). Yours is nice Photojojo!!

[photojojo]

Thanks for the details. I'm about halfway through my MF mapping and am a little lost on what FX combos would be best because I don't really use a whole lot of FX normally. So finding good combos and their most optimal settings has been a bit of a struggle. These ideas will definitely help.

[Yul]

I "think" Beatmasher(s), slicer and gater are mandatory with whatever you put them with or even together. As I priority I would always include with that a delay and or its freeze, a lfo of some kind and a reverb of some kind, as those would work most of time well with any other effect or Fx combos.
I use very often the beatmasher+f92lof+reverse grain amongst all others. I also use a lot of 'crush' of some kind so either beatmasher + lofi + reverb in an order or another (it depends) or I may replace the lofi by some mulholland or the like to get something a bit different from the common combinations.

I also like the t3 delay with different depths or values to be played with buttons (kinda like on the djm2000), you can be more "rhythmic" with it.

You may have thought already about it, but in case, for your midi fighter you may want if you have 8 buttons available, to separate your chained FX: your first 4 buttons will only engage a beatmasher alone, the next tree the beatmasher AND the LFO together and the last the beatmasher AND the lfo AND the reverse grain. It gives you more combinations.
As you already have the s4 and that your midi fighter is an add-on, you can probably create at least 8 different presets and more so you'll have plenty of choice anyway.
If you work with "blocks" of 2 fx units you can get even more creative in your settings.

[loop]

I'm thinking about something with a jogwheel, some faders and buttons and turn that into an FX machine.

The Reloop Contour would probably have what you need and has an OK price (~210EUR).



It's a damn good companion for the S4, IMO. If only the colour scheme was a better match

[Yul]

Yes that's what I had in mind and checked. A X1 would be nice but that would remove away the juggle mode idea because of the lack of fader(s) and jogwheel. Need more info on the product.

[loop]

Although announced months ago, it's on sale for just few weeks. There are not many people to give actual feedback.

a review of the interface edition is available at: http://www.digitaldjtips.com/2010/12...dj-controller/
There's also a controller edition w/o the built-in audio interface. The controller only retails for about 200EUR

[photojojo]

The Reloop Contour would probably have what you need and has an OK price (~210EUR).



It's a damn good companion for the S4, IMO. If only the colour scheme was a better match

Those faders are to short imo for using with FX. I think a modded midi fighter is still the best choice.

<thinking out loud> I wonder if you could use one of the encoders on a modded MF and make a larger jog wheel type "knob" for it? </thinking out loud>

[Yul]

Me. Want. A custom built midi fighter. Sexy sexy.

[Yul]

Forgot: some of the buttons I've mapped, set the parameters how I want it/them to be and I may add a 'increase' or 'decrease' setting for the amount that repeats itself so you can even emulate the movement of a fader in a sense or the other.