CDJ Pitch Accuracy - Page 3
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  1. #21
    Tech Mentor escapemcp's Avatar
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    The Versadeck 10-bit pitch fader thing - in internal playback, it only has 0.1% resolution... so when range is on 6%, you get 121 steps on the fader.... that's not even 7 bit. On the ADJ radius CDJs, they have a 4% range, giving only 81 steps! Joke is if you switch to 8% range, you get exactly the same accuracy (0.1% steps again!), just have to move the fader less! Bad design, which is what I am on about here Seeing as the pitch in midi has 10bit accuracy, it's not really the pitch fader, but the firmware in the unit.

    PC/Mhac, Traktor 2, Citronic MP-X10, 2 x Kam KCD450, Behringer BCD3000, Echo Audio Layla 3G, Numark EM-460 w/Kaoss Pad, Shure C606, Carlsbro Tytan PA, Turbosound TXD121 12" Tops, Reloop RHP-20
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  2. #22
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    My Versadeck is .05 in internal playback mode even at 16% pitch range. It shows it separately in the middle of the screen when you make a change briefly. The pitch readout on the right side only shows 0.1 increments like the Numarks do. (for the record, some older Numarks are something like 10-12bit res even though they also only show 0.1). It gets no better at lower ranges, though, on the Versadeck which means it's not completely taking advantage of the 10-bit pitch resolution in internal mode. You can get slightly better resolution with it as a MIDI controller. 0.05 is the useable minimum for a player and works fine with a little babysitting. But with a long 100mm fader and at the lower pitch ranges in USB player mode, very small movements of the fader can hypothetically do nothing. So you have to watch the screen to see if it changed or leave it at 16% range, which is what I usually do. Even then, very tiny movements might go unrecognized. If you’re not watching, you need to move bigger amounts to be sure. A 14bit fader wouldn't behave like that with the proper player firmware or MIDI emulation. And yeah, a firmware update could improve the 10bit fader here further... as would adding AIFF and/or FLAC support. And the pitch bend being time based, not rate based. And the lack of jog rotation sensitivity in options. All need to be fixed. I'm still crossing my fingers in futility.
    Last edited by Reticuli; 12-21-2012 at 07:08 PM.

  3. #23
    Tech Mentor escapemcp's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Reticuli View Post
    I'm still crossing my fingers in futility.
    Yup.. on my Citronic MP-X10, I have given up crossing my fingers... after a year it hurt too much. It went to 'discontinued' on their site about a week after I bought mine (and I was an early adopter!), meaning the new firmware update that came out for Versadeck etc hasn't been brought out for mine - thanks Citronic/AVSL! (that's a "don't buy their stuff warning" right there).

    Have recently purchased a Kam KCD450, and it's a bloody great CDJ - pitch accuracy down to 0.01% at 8% range, half that (0.02%) at 16 and 0.2% at 100 (actually 0.2% to +/-50% and then 0.3% beyond that) - which means that on 100% range on the KCD450, I am only losing half the accuracy when compared to my MP-X10 on 6% - go figure! That Kam deck though is bloody good for what it is. I got mine for £95 (2nd hand) and the only other CDJ that is in the same league is a Pioneer - I'd take mine over the lower/mid range Pio's as well (although I don't like Pioneer (or more like their rip-off pricing policy)). BTW & FYI: No midi on the Kam deck

    PC/Mhac, Traktor 2, Citronic MP-X10, 2 x Kam KCD450, Behringer BCD3000, Echo Audio Layla 3G, Numark EM-460 w/Kaoss Pad, Shure C606, Carlsbro Tytan PA, Turbosound TXD121 12" Tops, Reloop RHP-20
    http://soundcloud.com/escapemcp

  4. #24
    Tech Mentor escapemcp's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Reticuli View Post
    And the lack of jog rotation sensitivity in options.
    Amen brother! I switched to using the unit's pitch bend buttons as the jogs were too sensitive.

    Reticuli - tip 4 ya: Get a little 75W inverter for your car (plugs into cigarette lighter socket), a lead to connect your Versadeck/MP-X10 to your car stereo and you (or someone else) can mix as you drive . Although: if I mix and I am driving (which I probably shouldn't! ) the 0.1% accuracy thing comes back to bite me in the arse, as moving the pitch fader by feel alone means that I don't actually know whether the pitch/tempo has changed - which means looking at the unit - which means taking eyes off road - which is not good. It's not actually as dangerous as it sounds , as most of the time mixing you are simply listening - not actually needing to touch anything.

    Still, it's the best use I have found for this unit yet! Oh, and if the car judders a bit too much, the deck may go into stutter as the jog wheel gets moved

    PC/Mhac, Traktor 2, Citronic MP-X10, 2 x Kam KCD450, Behringer BCD3000, Echo Audio Layla 3G, Numark EM-460 w/Kaoss Pad, Shure C606, Carlsbro Tytan PA, Turbosound TXD121 12" Tops, Reloop RHP-20
    http://soundcloud.com/escapemcp

  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by escapemcp View Post
    Yup.. on my Citronic MP-X10, I have given up crossing my fingers... after a year it hurt too much. It went to 'discontinued' on their site about a week after I bought mine (and I was an early adopter!), meaning the new firmware update that came out for Versadeck etc hasn't been brought out for mine - thanks Citronic/AVSL! (that's a "don't buy their stuff warning" right there).

    Have recently purchased a Kam KCD450, and it's a bloody great CDJ - pitch accuracy down to 0.01% at 8% range, half that (0.02%) at 16 and 0.2% at 100 (actually 0.2% to +/-50% and then 0.3% beyond that) - which means that on 100% range on the KCD450, I am only losing half the accuracy when compared to my MP-X10 on 6% - go figure! That Kam deck though is bloody good for what it is. I got mine for £95 (2nd hand) and the only other CDJ that is in the same league is a Pioneer - I'd take mine over the lower/mid range Pio's as well (although I don't like Pioneer (or more like their rip-off pricing policy)). BTW & FYI: No midi on the Kam deck




    Seems somewhat similar to the ADJ Radius players and the Gemini 650. Which do you think is closest to the features here in the states? I'm wondering if one of these others is a rebranded version. The Gemini 650 and 700 seem to be the best buy here right now and do include AIFF support for lossless and tagging.

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by escapemcp View Post
    Thanks guys for that, was getting slated at the start of this thread... yeah, I CAN mix with shitty pitch controls and nudge, but if I'm spending money on my own kit, I don't wanna have to make do. Thanks for doing the 31 secs math, as I couldn't be arsed to work it out
    You should check out the Hanpin players like the Reloops in Europe for good pitch resolution.

  7. #27
    Tech Guru SlayForMoney's Avatar
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    Sweet mother of necrobumps....
    Denon X600 - 2x Denon SC-2000 - AKG K181DJ - NI Audio 2

  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by SlayForMoney View Post
    Sweet mother of necrobumps....
    True, but the pitch resolution is better on the later Hanpin players than Pioneer DJ, old Denon DJ (not sure about InMusic version), or Gemini. Basically the only USB media players I have come across with useful pitch resolution at all their ranges is from Hanpin. That said, some of the early versions of these players have older firmware that only does 0.1%, but this is at least at all ranges, even 100%. I think this is information everyone in the DJ scene should know about. This is still a relevant topic, especially as vinyl and USB players making a resurgence with those reinvigorating classic DJing methodology. I personally don't think it was wise for Reloop to change the SPDIF to a sync connection on the RMP-4, as I love SPDIF on digital units and hate sync, but I think the later Hanpins are more worthy to be the successor to the CDJ1000 than the CDJ2000 is.

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