How do you remember how many bars the intro or outro of a song has?

[shr3dder]

Ahhh the days of vinyl. If you stared closely you might be able to see the breakdown coming up.

[backtothefront]

I'm also in the camp of struggling to understand why you would want to remember or have visual aids for a track intro and outro (certainly from a dance music perspective), a basic grasp of song structure and listening to the track is all you need, in fact the track itself gives audible cues to when musical changes are going to occur (8 bars usually). With practice it hopefully will become 2nd nature, basic element to DJing IMHO.

[mfuchs19]

Dude Jason, you've given your input and that's all well and good but let people talk a little bit here. Nobody can say anything without you repeating yourself. Props to you if you never use cues but for many people they're very helpful so instead of acting superior to those who use cues, maybe explain how you mix without them and give some pointers because what you've been saying isn't adding much to the conversation.

Edit: Re reading your posts I realized I might have over reacted a little bit but I'm just getting annoyed with people competing for best DJ. Sorry if I came off sounding mean.

[Remco]

I'm honestly surprised to hear that a lot of people do this.

Me to....

[JasonBay]

Nothing to do with being superior, just astonished at how little DJ's know about music anymore and are relying more on technology to compensate for it, especially things that should come naturally to a DJ, liking being able to feel a track out and pick up on all the little audio cues that help define an arrangement and that should make it easier for them to mix.

[djlotus]

Does no one bother to learn the basics anymore? Learn the math behind the music. 4-16-32-64. These are your magic numbers
The formula for 99% of music produced at a time signature of 4/4 follows the number theory above.

[SirReal]

So, I spent the last three months collecting tracks for a mix. I then spent a week or so just listening to the tracks and assembling them in a general order for a demo mix based on the over all shape of the mix and what I thought would mix well together. When I finally had a free night to mix, I set Traktor to record and recorded my mix changing the order based on what I was feeling, never having mixed these tracks before. While it wasn't absolutely perfect, the timing on most mixies was pretty spot on, meaning, I was letting tracks play out to the end and hitting on the "drop" of the incoming track. Mixing was anywhere between 45 seconds to 4 minutes between tracks. My point? If you're familiar with your tracks and have a decent understanding of track structure, a lot of the "guess work" and pre-programming becomes useless, you just "feel it" Not really any other way to explain it, i liken it to the an Athlete being "in the zone". It's when you stop thinking so much and just "let go".

[JasonBay]

SirReal is a man after my own heart. I can't remember the last time I 'pre-planned' a set besides maybe know the first two or three tracks planned out so I don't have to think about it and just be in the zone, as SirReal puts it. Once you "let go" and don't worry about messing up and freaking out about how many bars are here or there, then you'll really start putting together some bomb ass mixes that just flow and go.

[shr3dder]

In 10 years of DJing I've never pre-planned a set.

I mean you have ideas like this goes with that, I'll close with that etc etc...

but in terms of planning what to play, where to mix out, setting cue points etc never. I kinda just trust my instincts. Plus its more fun that way.

[backtothefront]

This:

Does no one bother to learn the basics anymore? Learn the math behind the music. 4-16-32-64. These are your magic numbers
The formula for 99% of music produced at a time signature of 4/4 follows the number theory above.

This:

So, I spent the last three months collecting tracks for a mix. I then spent a week or so just listening to the tracks and assembling them in a general order for a demo mix based on the over all shape of the mix and what I thought would mix well together. When I finally had a free night to mix, I set Traktor to record and recorded my mix changing the order based on what I was feeling, never having mixed these tracks before. While it wasn't absolutely perfect, the timing on most mixies was pretty spot on, meaning, I was letting tracks play out to the end and hitting on the "drop" of the incoming track. Mixing was anywhere between 45 seconds to 4 minutes between tracks. My point? If you're familiar with your tracks and have a decent understanding of track structure, a lot of the "guess work" and pre-programming becomes useless, you just "feel it" Not really any other way to explain it, i liken it to the an Athlete being "in the zone". It's when you stop thinking so much and just "let go".

This:

SirReal is a man after my own heart. I can't remember the last time I 'pre-planned' a set besides maybe know the first two or three tracks planned out so I don't have to think about it and just be in the zone, as SirReal puts it. Once you "let go" and don't worry about messing up and freaking out about how many bars are here or there, then you'll really start putting together some bomb ass mixes that just flow and go.

and this:

In 10 years of DJing I've never pre-planned a set.

I mean you have ideas like this goes with that, I'll close with that etc etc...

but in terms of planning what to play, where to mix out, setting cue points etc never. I kinda just trust my instincts. Plus its more fun that way.

Totally agree with the posts above. It amazes me how many people get hung up on the tech and should I do this, should I do that. IMO, it's simple; more time with music and practice. DJing should be second nature, in fact I love mixing up new or unknown tracks, the only cue points I use is the first one at the start of track which Traktor puts in, I just don't use them, everything is done on the fly and looping when appropriate.

I suppose I'm just an old man at 34 who grew up with 2x turntables, a cheap mixer and a bunch of records, listened to loads of mixtapes and practiced. The digital age has brought lots of advantages and I'm for all for it but my approach has never changed. Please don't think this is some form of boastful post, it's not meant to be, DJing is not complicated but it is a skill to be learnt and as someone else said its about playing the right music at the right time.