Traktor Dropping ALAC support
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  1. #1
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    Default Traktor Dropping ALAC support

    Id love to get a bit of discussion on this, so im hoping to stir up NI.

    Here is my complete unhinged rant on the subject:

    http://www.native-instruments.com/fo...letter.230198/

  2. #2

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    I get the feeling it's not completely NI's fault in this, but that they are a third party stuck between two first parties who don't play well together in the schoolyard. It's just a hunch, I have nothing to back that up.

    Although I have no stake in this, I'm curious as to how this will play out.

  3. #3
    Tech Guru SlayForMoney's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ImNoDJ View Post
    Id love to get a bit of discussion on this, so im hoping to stir up NI.

    Here is my complete unhinged rant on the subject:

    http://www.native-instruments.com/fo...letter.230198/
    That's actually not a rant, sounds reasonable to me.
    Denon X600 - 2x Denon SC-2000 - AKG K181DJ - NI Audio 2

  4. #4
    Tech Guru mostapha's Avatar
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    Yeah....I'm really sorry. But I just can't bring myself to care. (ETA: ...on NI's side. It sucks for you)

    A long time ago, I tried FLAC and ALAC. Thanks to using a variety of devices and not liking mp3s, there wasn't a compressed format that would play on everything. Back then, drive space was still relatively expensive ( $2/GB for SSDs ), and I managed to switch just about everything to aiff.

    It's been a while, SSDs cost about 1/4 of what they did then, and nothing's changed. There still isn't a compressed file format that I like that will play on everything I have.

    I really don't get what the big deal is. Storage is still cheap, and it's not like you've got the excuse that Apple doesn't like letting people upgrade components anymore.
    Last edited by mostapha; 11-26-2014 at 01:44 PM.

  5. #5
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    That's really, really bad form on NI's part.

    I had a similar problem when I started using Rekordbox recently; ALAC isn't supported, and that has been my lossless format of choice for a long time. The difference there, though, is that I knew that going in; it's never supported ALAC.

    Having support, and then taking it away, is not on.

  6. #6
    DJTT Moderator bloke Karlos Santos's Avatar
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    I have to say that this thread title is slightly misleading.

    As is evident in the KB article, NI didn't drop support for ALAC, rather that Apple is forcing them down this road by deprecating support for Quicktime - big big difference. NI are trying to put ALAC support back in themselves with no help from Apple.

    I am not saying that it has been handled particularly well by NI nor that the anger is misplaced but this is clearly something that is being forced on NI and not NI forcing it on the users.

    I can't speak for Rekordbox as I rarely use it and I don't use ALAC but maybe Pioneer are suffering the same issue with Apple that NI are.

    For the record I have been speaking privately with ImNoDJ on this matter for some weeks so I'm not just wading in trying to blindly defend NI. I have been in constant contact with NI support on this matter due to it's affect on some of the NI forum members.

    Karlos

  7. #7
    Tech Guru mostapha's Avatar
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    Apple/Quicktime is probably one of the bigger pains in digital audio. I really don't know what the big deal is with them, but yeah...I believe it's Apple's fault.

    IIRC, Avid stuff tends to have some differences b/t OSX and Windows because of quicktime as well.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by mostapha View Post
    Yeah....I'm really sorry. But I just can't bring myself to care. (ETA: ...on NI's side. It sucks for you)

    A long time ago, I tried FLAC and ALAC. Thanks to using a variety of devices and not liking mp3s, there wasn't a compressed format that would play on everything. Back then, drive space was still relatively expensive ( $2/GB for SSDs ), and I managed to switch just about everything to aiff.

    It's been a while, SSDs cost about 1/4 of what they did then, and nothing's changed. There still isn't a compressed file format that I like that will play on everything I have.

    I really don't get what the big deal is. Storage is still cheap, and it's not like you've got the excuse that Apple doesn't like letting people upgrade components anymore.
    I think youve missed the crux. Youve also misunderstood that this issue only affects ALAC on PC. It works fine on Mac. Im a PC user.

    The issue is that NI has completely destroyed any trace of my traktor library if i ever wish to upgrade again.

    Once I change to a different file format, I lose everything, my playlists, cues, loops, history. All the stuff I use every day for DJing.

    I estimate at least 50 hours to do this, including a bunch of scripting to make it quicker.

    They did this with no notice and no explanation.

    Dont forget they released 2.7 and it said that 24 bit ALAC support was included. It was broken from the beginning.

    NI has either been incompetent or fraudulent about this, there really isnt any third option.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Karlos Santos View Post
    I have to say that this thread title is slightly misleading.

    As is evident in the KB article, NI didn't drop support for ALAC, rather that Apple is forcing them down this road by deprecating support for Quicktime - big big difference. NI are trying to put ALAC support back in themselves with no help from Apple.

    I am not saying that it has been handled particularly well by NI nor that the anger is misplaced but this is clearly something that is being forced on NI and not NI forcing it on the users.

    I can't speak for Rekordbox as I rarely use it and I don't use ALAC but maybe Pioneer are suffering the same issue with Apple that NI are.

    For the record I have been speaking privately with ImNoDJ on this matter for some weeks so I'm not just wading in trying to blindly defend NI. I have been in constant contact with NI support on this matter due to it's affect on some of the NI forum members.

    Karlos
    Karlos,

    Im sorry but NI have been completely evasive and uncommuniative from the very beginning.

    Regardless of what Apple did, the fact that NI posted a patch with a new feature that they clearly didnt test is incompetence. To then blame that on Apple is pathetic. This is a problem with NIs process and communication.

    Apple and MS do not change these things overnight, they have roadmaps. If they told me about this 6 months ago, i would have been miffed, but I would have gotten on with my life.

    The fact that they will completely remove a feature of Traktor, unanounced that destroys my entire library, means they will probably do it again.

    Is there some other way I should be looking at this?

    When am I supposed to spend the 50+ hours I estimate its going to take to completely and manually rebuild my playlists, cues, loops, gains, BPMs? Is this reasonable that I should have to do this with no notice?

    Im clearly one of the only people this affects, but in my case its catastrophic.

    I work in large scale IT mate, this is unnaceptable behaviour.

  10. #10
    Tech Guru mostapha's Avatar
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    If it's that big of a deal that things keep working, why would you go all in on alac? It's kind of a niche format in a world of niche formats.

    Does traktor not support flac, and do you really need the space savings?

    Basically.....this happens with QuickTime. Why trust it in the first place?

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