Macbook Pro worth it

[Scalage]

A broken clock is right twice a day

It's not broken at all. I do live gigs with it all the time. Just two days ago in fact.

[deevey]

It's not broken at all. I do live gigs with it all the time. Just two days ago in fact.

By that I mean that when you release hundreds of different models as HP have, you are bound to get it right eventually with one of them.

No Argument, Windows 7 is pretty stable when freshly installed, but when you buy a computer should you really need to do a fresh install or tweak it so it works correctly ?

Fortunately for you, yours one is the exceptions rather than what is the norm and as you mentioned you had to replace the default OS to get it stable (time + money).

[Scalage]

By that I mean that when you release hundreds of different models as HP have, you are bound to get it right eventually with one of them.

No Argument, Windows 7 is pretty stable when freshly installed, but when you buy a computer should you really need to do a fresh install or tweak it so it works correctly ?

Fortunately for you, yours one is the exceptions rather than what is the norm and as you mentioned you had to replace the default OS to get it stable (time + money).

I never actually reinstalled windows 7 when I think about it. I just installed it over vista. It was free as well and took about an hour in total. I never tinkered with anything at all. It just worked as is. There is this weird bias that you need to be some kind of computer genius to work with windows, and it's simply not true. My desktop computers have averaged a lifespan of about 7 years and they were only replaced because if higher software demands. All of them have run windows. The only upgrades I did to those was a better graphics card or more ram. And that's also because of higher software demands.

How do you know I am an exception? I know lots of people that use their laptop or desktop for ages.

[johnnypepp]

Then howcome my HP 8530w laptop is still going strong after almost six years of pretty intensive use? The only time I reinstalled windows was when I moved from the abomination that is windows vista to 7, no component has ever been replaced or upgraded apart from the battery and it has been in a motorcycle accident.

Well, I was talking about cheaper laptops. Yours is a top end model and is rightly so still under the living. Here's a piece from notebook review on your HP :

"The HP EliteBook 8530w is the latest 15.4″ workstation featuring the latest Intel processors and Nvidia Quadro FX 770M wrapped inside an impressively durable shell. The Elitebook 8530w and 8530p (non-workstation version) replace the 8510w and 8510p, respectively. Is it time for an upgrade at your office? Take a look and see what we have to say about this powerful workhorse!

The 8530w starts out at $1,499 but more powerful configurations top out at $3,549."

And that's the point I was trying to make, for similar quality you will pay similar prices. A mate of mine runs a computershop and they get flooded with faulty cheap laptops. They get send back if they're still in warranty, but otherwise you just got to buy a new one because they aren't even bothering with repairs.

[deevey]

There is this weird bias that you need to be some kind of computer genius to work with windows, and it's simply not true.

You are completely right, you don't need to be a computer genius to work windows, and if you have a decent machine with decent drivers available, and do things by the book e.g. surf safe 100% of the time, uninstall all the in-built Crapware on day1 .. and you'll probably be fine for a long time.

However most people do not, and accept that the email they got offering of $100 free money is legit and end up replacing their machine because its "running slow", not due to hardware issues, but socially engineered vulnerabilities that are exploited on the windows platform.

My desktop computers have averaged a lifespan of about 7 years and they were only replaced because if higher software demands. All of them have run windows. The only upgrades I did to those was a better graphics card or more ram. And that's also because of higher software demands.

Great, you don't do anything stupid, I commend you.

How do you know I am an exception? I know lots of people that use their laptop or desktop for ages.

Yes, the average person can use windows, but IMHO the average person is incapable of maintaining it over a long period of time or when things go even slightly pear shaped - many don't do anything intensive enough to realize that their computer is running slower than it should.

On Call Service engineer for 12+ years, and about 80% of the callouts were down to users downloading crap, bad software installs or in some cases just not shutting down their computer correctly would cause OS corruption. In short, people tend to tinker and try things out. Don't even get me started on them installing their own antivirus packages!

Yes, I can maintain windows just fine, and still do for certain software, however, I choose to make my own life easier by not worrying about the next program I update causing an un-recoverable BSOD, by using a "native" version itunes to manage my music, using core audio instead of propriety drivers, and using an operating system that has been developed solely to work really really well with one manufacturers very reliable hardware.

The hardware in a Mac is no more reliable than a top of the line Alienware or Asus, sure. Maybe if OSX was available for any old $1500 computer I'd probably buy one. But that would sacrifice reliability and stability, as the drivers would then need to be just as reliable across thousands of differently configured machines. Its the entire OS and ecosystem that you buy into with Macs that makes and keeps things stable.

Anyhow a PC of comparable specs to a Macbook Pro e.g. Dell XPS 15' is almost the same price @ $2400.

Please, you need to install a separate app to prevent a mac going into sleep when you close a lid on it. Need I say more?

Only if you do not have a secondary display connected, which you normally would if you are closing the lid.

[mostapha]

Please, you need to install a separate app to prevent a mac going into sleep when you close a lid on it. Need I say more?

No, you don't. You need to have a display and a keyboard connected to it. And the fact that app exists is proof that you can tweak it. The only reason you would need the app is that you don't know how to do it yourself, so some developer decided to make it easier for you.

Seriously, what can you do with Windows that you can't do with OS X?

[SlayForMoney]

Seriously, what can you do with Windows that you can't do with OS X?

Close a lid on my laptop during a gig without it going to sleep and shuting down the music. Enough for you?

[mostapha]

No, because OS X can do that either with an app or writing your own little utility. If it did that by default, my laptop battery would be constantly discharging and would shorten its life.

[deevey]

Seriously, what can you do with Windows that you can't do with OS X?

Run Windows Media Player
Use Microsoft Paint
Install Norton Utilites and Spybot Search and Destroy
Format c:

Important Stuff like that

[mostapha]

Run Windows Media Player - That's a preference. I hate WMP when I have to use it. Cog is my preferred player.

Use Microsoft Paint - paintbrush has been available for years. Seahorse is similar but a little more powerful. Gimp is like photoshop without the good select tools and free (though I think it's available on windows too).

Install Norton Utilites and Spybot Search and Destroy - Screw Norton. I use Clam, which is free and updated just as fast and is the same thing I use on my linux and bsd boxes.

Format c: - I still think drive letters are stupid, but that's a preference thing. `diskutil reformat /dev/disk0s2` does what you want up until the system crashes. And diskutil is more poweful than the disk utilities available on CLI for windows. Expanding on that a little bit, Disk Utility (the graphical app) vs. MS's disk and volume management software is largely a matter of preference, but I'll admit that the graphical Disk Utility has it's problems....that 90% of users are never going to encounter. There are 3rd party applications for both platforms that provide better management of more complicated disk things (e.g., complex raid setups). But, really, when you get into things like that, Linux and the BSDs provide better support for next gen filesystems than Windows or OS X.

I'm really surprised you didn't mention gaming. 'cuz that's one thing where Windows just wins. Also certain business software that I don't care about and works fine inside a VM anyway.