DJ's switching back to hardware article, and a FB post from a house music legend.
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  1. #1
    Tech Guru sobi's Avatar
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    Default DJ's switching back to hardware article, and a FB post from a house music legend.

    So that article was fairly interesting. Kind of a cool insight into everyone's choices and where they (possibly) seem to be evolving to. Ironically, a few hours after I saw the article, house music legend Kenny Summit made this post to his Facebook page regarding his club in L.A.
    Screen Shot 2016-05-31 at 6.50.03 PM.jpg
    To me, it almost pushes a thought I've been personally having. I LOVE Traktor, and personally think it's a better way to play that offers more possibilities. That said, the article and his post in one day almost push me over the edge on the though I've been having about moving to record box and away from the laptop to a more standard club set up.

    Comments on the article are encouraged, but what do you guys think about the new policy at Cure and Cause? What do you think about the possible changing gear climate?

  2. #2
    Tech Mentor overcast's Avatar
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    The feeling I get comes back to this quote from the article:

    ...DJs are seen as “not serious” if they are playing with controllers.
    When I was at a non-commercial college radio station we have several different DJs (where in this case "DJ" means someone actively mixing songs, NOT typical builds a playlist to play through each song as a whole and interjects between songs DJ) of varying levels of experience. Most used controllers because they were cheaper and easier to transport. A few were CDJ or turntable based without a computer in the fray. And everyone was just as serious a DJ in my opinion. One of the consistently best and on-point DJs (and guy who was invaluable to expanding my ability as well) learned using a Mixtrack Pro and VirtualDJ. One the crappiest attitudes of the DJs I dealt with was the guy with a full Pioneer CDJ/Mixer setup. And vice-versa.

    tl;dr: The gear doesn't make the DJ. I'd rather go out to a set where a DJ has complete mastery of a controller and it's software and uses the two in innovative ways, than go to a set where a DJ is adequately using "industry standards"

  3. #3
    Tech Mentor PartyMcFly's Avatar
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    I think we are realizing that even with the amazing software tools available to us, in 2016 a great number of DJs still sound like they are mixing deck A to B and back as if on CDJs.

    We have these outrageously powerful tools in software but people are tired of bringing expensive laptops and controller rigs to hostile environments if they are still going to end up sounding like anyone else on modern CDJs with a waveform, quick loops, and a sync button. Putting those basic features on CDJs has progressed mainstream DJing far more than remix slots and four-deck live mashups with an S4 has.

    I believe there is a very, very small minority of Traktor or Serato users outside of niche genres like techno that use more than simple two deck mixing on a regular basis and in a way that actually affects the mix in creative and novel ways.

    Native Instruments created a beautiful and complex musical instrument, sold it to disc jockeys and selectors, and now we are finding out that most of us really only use it to be disc jockeys and selectors instead of the genre-bending boundary-pushing beat astronauts we thought we'd become. Out of thousands of users out there in the world today, very few of us are actually using the software as a performance or studio instrument beyond A to B mixing with loops and effects.

    I am not saying you shouldn't push boundaries to be that four deck midifighter youtube beat astronaut. I am saying that we should recognize when we think we are progressing radically but actually are maintaining the status quo.

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    I view that facebook post as someone who hasn't spent enough time with software and might feel threatened by it.

    CDJs and controllers really don't differ that much for modern CDJs anyways other than where you look for your information.
    Bedroom DJ | Pioneer DJM-800 | Pioneer CDJ2000 and CDJ900-NXS | 2 x Mackie MR8MKII | Sennheiser Amperior

  5. #5
    Tech Guru sobi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SlvrDragon50 View Post
    I view that facebook post as someone who hasn't spent enough time with software and might feel threatened by it.

    CDJs and controllers really don't differ that much for modern CDJs anyways other than where you look for your information.
    That guy has probably spent more time with more software AND hardware than 90% of this board. lol



    I've definitely felt the same way as far as there being no reason to focus on what you play on vs how good you can play. That said, having a "standard setup" really does sort of force the cream to rise to the top when a standard is in place.
    Reading further into the thread on facebook, I also saw some valid points from them... as a venue, a single standard setup eliminates problems they've had with people not really leaving things as they've found them when it comes to people bringing in equipment, and cuts down on "set up issues".

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    Quote Originally Posted by sobi View Post
    That guy has probably spent more time with more software AND hardware than 90% of this board. lol



    I've definitely felt the same way as far as there being no reason to focus on what you play on vs how good you can play. That said, having a "standard setup" really does sort of force the cream to rise to the top when a standard is in place.
    Reading further into the thread on facebook, I also saw some valid points from them... as a venue, a single standard setup eliminates problems they've had with people not really leaving things as they've found them when it comes to people bringing in equipment, and cuts down on "set up issues".
    I don't really know him so I might be making up assumptions.

    I just find his logic full of faults. If you want to say CDJs only for setup reasons, sure that's fine. But saying CDJs only because only skilled people can use CDJs is absolutely absurd. Just look at the DDJ-SZ which is pretty much the exact same as a 2 CDJ setup.
    Bedroom DJ | Pioneer DJM-800 | Pioneer CDJ2000 and CDJ900-NXS | 2 x Mackie MR8MKII | Sennheiser Amperior

  7. #7
    Tech Mentor PartyMcFly's Avatar
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    Yeah, that's just old guy tribalism and gatekeeping behavior. But it's his club so it his right to be just another old guy gatekeeping what he thinks are either professional tools or toys.

    I especially like the part where controllers are allowed if you're doing something that he is already aesthetically familiar with like a DMC routine or controlling a Ritchie Hawtin spaceship cockpit. It's just so telling of where he's coming from with this.

    If his reasons were along the lines of "we don't want extra cables and gear crowding up the booth" or "they make changeovers a nightmare in here" or something like that I'd be more sympathetic, but I don't have a high view of that FB post either. I'm not impressed with someone's bonafides, past achievements, or authority if they don't display the ability to think flexibly and understand change.
    Last edited by PartyMcFly; 05-31-2016 at 08:47 PM. Reason: typohs!!!

  8. #8
    Tech Guru DJAdeSands's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PartyMcFly View Post
    I believe there is a very, very small minority of Traktor or Serato users outside of niche genres like techno that use more than simple two deck mixing on a regular basis and in a way that actually affects the mix in creative and novel ways.

    Native Instruments created a beautiful and complex musical instrument, sold it to disc jockeys and selectors, and now we are finding out that most of us really only use it to be disc jockeys and selectors instead of the genre-bending boundary-pushing beat astronauts we thought we'd become. Out of thousands of users out there in the world today, very few of us are actually using the software as a performance or studio instrument beyond A to B mixing with loops and effects.
    Totally agree with this.. ^^

    This is probably what's pissed this Kenny Summit guy off tbh.. the lack of creativity of those who bring creative tools into the zone. Must of had a bad experience with one (or more) of those DJ's..

    Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk
    Last edited by DJAdeSands; 06-02-2016 at 12:57 PM.
    Denon DJ/MC6000KMK2/Launchpad S/LaunchcontrolXL/Traktor Pro 2/Bringin it since 96.

  9. #9
    Tech Mentor Chael's Avatar
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    If it sounds good coming out of the speakers then I don't really care what people are using. I have heard amazing sets done on turntables, cdjs and controllers aswell as bad sets done on turntables, cdjs and controllers. People tend to get annoyed when something comes along that changes the game and makes something easier for people to do than what took someone else years to master on old kit. In my opinion CDJs are controllers once you plug that USB stick in anyway. Who wants to spend hours sorting through vinyl and damaging their spine whilst lugging a heavy box around gig to gig? who wants to spend hours burning cds and printing out the tracklists for them? again lugging around a massive cd wallet? Times change, technology moves on, we are all doing this (or should be doing this) for the love of music - embrace it, share it and enjoy it. Opinions like this just divide us on something we all love doing and it makes others feel inadequate when they should not have to feel that way for doing what they enjoy the way they want to do it

  10. #10
    Tech Guru Nicky H's Avatar
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    He has a point - why turn up with loads of extra gear when all you need is a USB stick these days.
    CDJ's have moved on from the 1000's - you don't need a laptop any-more for this type of club.
    SC | MC

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