Denon SC5000 Prime - Page 7
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  1. #61

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    They should have just branded the whole new line part of the Numark Professional Products Division and the new software Prime. Using the Denon DJ and Engine branding in my opinion was a mistake as it alienates the old Denon DJ user base still on the old gear they've abandoned. The few of the original Denon DJ staff that remained ought to have been just folded into Numark. I really don't think for most of the industry Denon DJ was such an elite branding nor Numark so tarnished to justify the strategy they took. Nonetheless, it's done. I hope they add the options to the SC5000 and Engine Prime that people are asking for.

  2. #62
    Tech Guru SlayForMoney's Avatar
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    Ryan, where are those pictures?
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  3. #63
    Tech Convert Tellor01's Avatar
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    This thread is dead or what ? Why nobody talk about the prime set-up and SC5000 ? Any news about update for Engine and SC5000 ?
    NAAGRA (La Chinerie Festival ,L'Appart Music )
    Pioneer CDJ900Nexus - Denon SC5000 PRIME - Allen & Heath Xone DB4 - Allen & Heath xone K1 - Stanton ST150
    Dyanudio BM12A Speaker - Esi Aktiv 10S (Subwoofer) - Native Maschine MK3 - T-Rack DS2/4

  4. #64
    Tech Guru mostapha's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tellor01 View Post
    This thread is dead or what ? Why nobody talk about the prime set-up and SC5000 ? Any news about update for Engine and SC5000 ?
    In short....

    • It's still limted compared to a computer setup.
    • Unless I'm mistaken, on this forum in particular, Traktor users are still the largest demographic.
    • They only have flagship products in the line at the moment.
    • Engine itself is newer and less-proven than it's direct competitors.
    • Engine was based on Mixvibes, which was always an "also ran", not a contender.
    • Despite #changeyourrider, the number of Pros asking for it hasn't grown that much.
    • Denon has a long history of abandoning otherwise awesome products, at least in the eyes of the tech-savvy.
    • The layer thing is cool, but Denon as done it before. A long time ago. On a lot of their players. Basically all of them, in fact. Very few people made use of them then, and very few of the #changeyourrider crew who use more than 2 decks only tour with 2 of them. None of them tour with 1.
    • Performance pads are cool, but Pioneer stuff can do that with an add-on controller and a firmware update instead of needing a whole new system.
    • There has been basically no adoption in clubs that I've seen. The DJs that are part of their marketing campaign (Laidback Luke comes to mind) travel with the equipment and a Denon rep.


    The big thing is that it's still around $6k to try it out. A pioneer setup with similar capabilities is over $10k, but it's a known quantity and, in most pro/install cases, already speant, even if they own nothing. A club, festival production company, live sound rental company, etc. only providing Prime stuff would be business suicide. So, you're not comparing $6k per setup to $10k per setup, you're not even comparing ~$9500/setup to $10k/setup. You're comparing $10k/setup for Pioneer to $20k/setup for both. I know big names and production companies don't pay retail, but the discounts would have to be huge for buying Denon to make any sense to them unless they just don't care about money.

    They might have a chance at overtaking Pioneer, but they really do need to release a budget line (players, mixers, and controllers) to attract young DJs and have them request them at gigs, support the products while it looks like they're going to fail, actually release promised updates at some point, get some heavy-hitters in genres other than big-room EDM on board for their tours and resiencies and making YT clips (not on Denon's channel), AND offer huge discounts to installers to make any headway.

    And they've already lost that battle once...back when it was just CDs and no preparation and you actually could show up, do nothing different, and play.

    The DJ world changes very slowly, at least on the pro side. The CDJ-1000mk2s had been out for a while before there was a widespread view of CD players except as one of those things some clubs install just in case. And that was after Denon was slightly preferred for a lot of the 19" rack mount dual-CD-deck players.

    They've got a long way to go. Pioneer, OTOH, have somehow convinced a lot of people (thankfully not everyone) to think that $2k for a single-deck HID controller for Serato makes any kind of sense at all. That's what they're up against.

    It'll be at least another year, and only then if Denon plays their cards right and kills it at this and the next NAMM.

    Frankly, I hope they do it. I really do. But the smart money is elsewhere for the time being.
    Last edited by mostapha; 01-16-2018 at 08:35 AM.

  5. #65
    Tech Convert Tellor01's Avatar
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    It's still limted compared to a computer setup.
    Agree but the point is the possibility to mix without computer ! for me who play underground venues House music i don't want computer in the booth

    Unless I'm mistaken, on this forum in particular, Traktor users are still the largest demographic.
    yes but traktor is consider dead and still no big update and product !


    Engine itself is newer and less-proven than it's direct competitors.
    It's not traktor or rekordbox i'm agree lot of useful thing missing (No cover art for flac, Flexible beatgrids, mass tagging...)

    Despite #changeyourrider, the number of Pros asking for it hasn't grown that much
    Yes it's pretty sad lot of my friend play only vinyl or CDJ ...


    Denon has a long history of abandoning otherwise awesome products, at least in the eyes of the tech-savvy.
    Maybe it can change for the prime set up and the Namm2018 approaching ? but i'm still angry about abandonning the MCX8000...

    Performance pads are cool, but Pioneer stuff can do that with an add-on controller and a firmware update instead of needing a whole new system.
    Yeah another controller add on for 400 euros... Typically pioneer marketing

    There has been basically no adoption in clubs that I've seen. The DJs that are part of their marketing campaign (Laidback Luke comes to mind) travel with the equipment and a Denon rep.
    Don't understand that either DJ are not open minded with DJ gear they swears only with pioneer !


    Denon SC5000 is still pretty awesome ! i have two with a Xone DB4 ! the hardware is very cool better than Nexus 2 ! 4400 euros for plastic really ? and less feature than Traktor or serato ? about the SC5000 they are some little annoyances like the beatcounter who doesn't work only if YNC are activate ! 2.4gb date limit is unacceptable but what the point to have 10000 songs ?

    i wish that Denon reveal abig update for engine prime and SC5000/X18000 for the NAMM 2018 ! DJ Worx said a new beta coming soon !

    sorry for my english it's not my native language !
    NAAGRA (La Chinerie Festival ,L'Appart Music )
    Pioneer CDJ900Nexus - Denon SC5000 PRIME - Allen & Heath Xone DB4 - Allen & Heath xone K1 - Stanton ST150
    Dyanudio BM12A Speaker - Esi Aktiv 10S (Subwoofer) - Native Maschine MK3 - T-Rack DS2/4

  6. #66
    Tech Guru mostapha's Avatar
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    My issue is that DJWorx has said a beta was around the corner for a long time. Because Denon told them that. And it's not there.

    Other than that, I agree with almost everything you said (except that I still prefer Traktor despite the no updates, and haven't even done the latest one because I don't see the point; and I have no problem with computers because I just don't care anymore). You asked why the thread was dead. That's why I think it's dead. Because Prime is in desperate need of better support and more products. Period. It doesn't matter if it's a better product unless they can actually compete with Pioneer across the board.

  7. #67

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    Quote Originally Posted by mostapha View Post
    In short....
    [*]Engine was based on Mixvibes, which was always an "also ran", not a contender.
    I thought early versions of Rekordbox were based on Mixvibes under license. Never heard of old Engine being based on it, let alone Engine Prime.

    People who've bought them probably are too busy DJing. There are a few people with them on rotary forums talking about them.

    I am waiting until they add a retro mode to disable sync, turn off moving waveforms, and hide BPM information. I'm also waiting for them to fix their database size and linking limits.

    It's got unlimited apparent software upgrade-ability, superior pitch resolution to the Pioneers, and no jog bend dead zone. When this other stuff is done, I will definitely buy them.

    I think it's a horrible idea, by the way, for Denon to start putting out a ton of Prime products for various feature/price bracketing. Pioneer and Numark already do that enough. I would like to see a hybrid combination of the SC5000 and VL12, though, maybe put out under the Numark branding. Heck, they could just use the TTX stuff for the turntable side. One channel the digital player, other channel phono. Engine Prime itself needs to become cross-brand to become widely accepted.
    Last edited by Reticuli; 01-16-2018 at 10:01 PM.

  8. #68
    Tech Guru the_bastet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Reticuli View Post
    I thought early versions of Rekordbox were based on Mixvibes under license. Never heard of old Engine being based on it, let alone Engine Prime.

    People who've bought them probably are too busy DJing. There are a few people with them on rotary forums talking about them.

    I am waiting until they add a retro mode to disable sync, turn off moving waveforms, and hide BPM information. I'm also waiting for them to fix their database size and linking limits.

    It's got unlimited apparent software upgrade-ability, superior pitch resolution to the Pioneers, and no jog bend dead zone. When this other stuff is done, I will definitely buy them.

    I think it's a horrible idea, by the way, for Denon to start putting out a ton of Prime products for various feature/price bracketing. Pioneer and Numark already do that enough. I would like to see a hybrid combination of the SC5000 and VL12, though, maybe put out under the Numark branding. Heck, they could just use the TTX stuff for the turntable side. One channel the digital player, other channel phono. Engine Prime itself needs to become cross-brand to become widely accepted.
    Especially with Pioneer appearing to start lowering their price points on equipment this year.
    - Equipment - 2X Technics 1200, 2X Audio Technica ATLP1240, 2X XDJ700, 2X XDJ1000 MK2, Denon DNX-1100, Mixars DUO, DJM750 MK2, NI Audio 10, NI Aduio 4, Serato SL3, 4X Shure M44-7, 2X Ortofon Pro S, 2X Numark Groove Tool, Maschine MK3, Samson Carbon 49, Roland SE-02, Novation Launchcontrol, TouchOSC, Nocation Peak, Arturia MiniBrute, Korg Volca Kick, MicroKorg (Classic), NI Komplete Audio 6

  9. #69
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    I'm still quite happy with my SC5000 pair and the X1800 mixer.

    I'm a bit disappointed updates to Engine Prime have been as slow going as they have been. That software right now is a weak link in the whole setup.

  10. #70
    Tech Convert Tellor01's Avatar
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    I am waiting until they add a retro mode to disable sync, turn off moving waveforms, and hide BPM information. I'm also waiting for them to fix their database size and linking limits.
    1000% agree with you mate ! This is the number one prioritie now ! what do you mean by retro mode ? beat counter right ? it's pretty annoying actually !

    I'm a bit disappointed updates to Engine Prime have been as slow going as they have been. That software right now is a weak link in the whole setup.
    Really don't understand why denon take so long to update the SC5000 and engine prime WTF And no any news except with DJ Worx and Denon Forum said an update early 2018

    sorry for my english it's not my native language
    NAAGRA (La Chinerie Festival ,L'Appart Music )
    Pioneer CDJ900Nexus - Denon SC5000 PRIME - Allen & Heath Xone DB4 - Allen & Heath xone K1 - Stanton ST150
    Dyanudio BM12A Speaker - Esi Aktiv 10S (Subwoofer) - Native Maschine MK3 - T-Rack DS2/4

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