Xone K2 Question - Page 2
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  1. #11
    Tech Guru mostapha's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by electroshock View Post
    Like a "real deal", immune to a possible latency. Same as comparing the jog nudge with a 1200s platter nudge. Both can work equally well but there's the risk of "hangs".
    I disagree.

    What you're saying isn't necessarily wrong, but you're oversimplifying the picture.

    It's down to the quality of the controller and how well set up they are. The "problem" is that DJ gear has been a game of "good enough" for a very long time. And, at the same time, people have different definitions of good enough.

    The K2 doesn't feel good enough to replace a mixer.

    But...on the other end....

    I've mixed on one of these before:



    It's a controller for Pro Tools'a internal mixer. I've also mixed on an SSL console. And, the controller was a better experience.

    With digital mixers, you're essentially using a control surface and a single-use computer too. And they're responsible for a LOT of live and studio sound setups and a lot of DJ setups.

    "Controller" is not the problem.


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  2. #12

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    Quote Originally Posted by happydan View Post
    I've had latency on the faders of professional-level digital mixers before. I've also had a catastrophic crash on a very recent flagship digital club mixer, requiring a complete unplug and restart. My point being that the idea hardware mixers are somehow more reliable is false.
    Key word - digital. Your bad experience with digital mixers may be also seen as an additional argument to be wary with controllers coz they are even "more digital". What I had on mind as a "real thing" was a completely analog hardware.
    Quote Originally Posted by happydan View Post
    There are much better arguments for using a hardware mixer. Dedicated controls and audio routing, for one. Probably having separate booth and main out controls. Modular options. Arguably higher quality components. More input/output connections.
    Most of this is possible with controller and is up to the software/soundcard, isn't it? My basic dislike I was talking about is that with a controller I'll always feel like walking on eggs. Not saying they can't feel equally good as hardware, but you're dependent on the computer you use, which is not the case with standalone hardware.

    Quote Originally Posted by happydan View Post
    Don't get me wrong, I would always prefer to use my Xone setup, but for regular old DJing (which is the vast bulk of what people do), you wouldn't notice any difference in the final recording on a controller vs a hardware mixer.
    Soundwise mostly not (depends on the soundcard), but the physical feel of manipulation may be different, me thinks.

  3. #13

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    Quote Originally Posted by mostapha View Post
    It's down to the quality of the controller and how well set up they are.
    Also the computer in use.

  4. #14
    Tech Guru mostapha's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by electroshock View Post
    Key word - digital. Your bad experience with digital mixers may be also seen as an additional argument to be wary with controllers coz they are even "more digital". What I had on mind as a "real thing" was a completely analog hardware.
    "More digital" isn't a thing. It either is or isn't. Kind of like digital. But, keeping in mind what you mean...

    Quote Originally Posted by electroshock View Post
    Most of this is possible with controller and is up to the software/soundcard, isn't it? My basic dislike I was talking about is that with a controller I'll always feel like walking on eggs. Not saying they can't feel equally good as hardware, but you're dependent on the computer you use, which is not the case with standalone hardware.
    There are some really fantastic controllers out there, even for reasonable sums. The Pioneer DDJ line, for example. Back in the day, my VCM-600 felt better than 90% of DJ mixers on the market. Pretty much anything NI makes (apart from jog wheels) feels different but as high quality as just about anything out there until you get into boutique stuff.

    And saying it's dependent on the computer ignores the obvious comparison to minutia of components. In a computer, you're mostly talking about software setup and maintenance. In general, the hardware is pretty good. With analog stuff, just about everything has the potential to affect the sound. Analog design differences get into very small things that can have a big impact and that the vast majority of people aren't even dimly aware of. And, don't forget that CDJs are basically computers with controllers built in.

    If you're talking pure vinyl...I guarantee you that your stylus is more fragile than anything in even the cheapest controllers.

    As for capabilities...it goes either way. And it's mostly down to the design decisions made for each product, not whether they did it with bits or resistors.

    Quote Originally Posted by electroshock View Post
    Soundwise mostly not (depends on the soundcard), but the physical feel of manipulation may be different, me thinks.
    It's actually incredibly easy to make a DSP or general purpose computer do all the things a DJ mixer does. Especially with modern technology. The sound card itself is the complicated part, and the feel of the controls.

    Analog mixers also require high-quality components (in many cases the same components) for the controls to feel right.

    I'm all for the best tool for the job, and you like what you like. But, what you're talking about comes down to the elusive "vibe" that some pieces of gear have.

    There's a reason I run Traktor (or rekordbox, whatever) into an analog Rane. But, it's not because it's analog. Frankly, I'd probably like it better if I were playing all digital through the mixer, through Class-D amps, all the way to conversion right before voice coils.

    So...if your argument is about sound...there are a few little "gotchas" in digital audio that a lot of people (and companies) still haven't made easy. If your argument is about feel or vibe, it's about the speicfic devices.

  5. #15
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    If you route two channels to control them via external mixer - you get more controls on K2 for other important software functions.
    BTW - I can highly recommend Allen Heath Xone K2. Great quality controller & sound. It works amazing standalone as well as with external mixer. Very portable and with proper mapping - covers all necessary functions, so you can just have one K2 with computer and play a gig without touching your laptop even once.

  6. #16
    Tech Guru the_bastet's Avatar
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    Well I finally skimmed this and guess Imma have to give it a full read over. This thread went in a whole different direction.
    - Equipment - 2X Technics 1200, 2X Audio Technica ATLP1240, 2X XDJ700, 2X XDJ1000 MK2, Denon DNX-1100, Mixars DUO, DJM750 MK2, NI Audio 10, NI Aduio 4, Serato SL3, 4X Shure M44-7, 2X Ortofon Pro S, 2X Numark Groove Tool, Maschine MK3, Samson Carbon 49, Roland SE-02, Novation Launchcontrol, TouchOSC, Nocation Peak, Arturia MiniBrute, Korg Volca Kick, MicroKorg (Classic), NI Komplete Audio 6

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