any blind mac djs here?

Hi everyone,

I just read the thread started by one of the tech gurus here about tango's endeavor in getting somewhat appropriated with traktor pro whilst being legally blind.

I myself am totally blind and have been questing for the same thing for a year and a half now.

My results aren't as convincing and admirable as tango's as i use a somewhat accessible software for the mac called dj from algoriddim, but it being rather limited in features, i've been growing interest in the more pro apps such as itch or traktor, even ableton if that one can mark some accessibility.

But the question here is whether any of these applications are actualy accessible to mac users.

For one, traktor has absolutely no point of reference or sound cue to tell us where or what its doing, and ableton so far has only "unknown" labels wherever i navigate through the interface.

Has anyone gotten past that biggest hurdle and found a way to play a bit more, scratch, do some simple mixes or cue juggling with any of these?

I own a vci 300 and its normally perfectly mapped for itch but it also is the case for dj, but as i said i've actually exhausted its possibilities, adding control pads for effects and samples but can't go anywhere further apart from honing my scratching skills.

Any help or pointer would be greatly appreciated, and it seems as though the people in this forum are extremely well versed and helpful.
Thanks in advance for anything i could get my hands on and test its capabilities for blind users.

Best

Lance Blaise and Tango are the only two that are blind that I know of on here. Lance used traktor when he had site so he was ahead of the game a little. tango recently posted that he had bought traktor so he's well on his way now. Where are you located? Shiftee posted in Tango's thread that he and Dubspot would help him out, but they're in New York.

Hi fotojojo, are you jojo as in the photography gadget jojo? :)

I'm in Auckland new zealand, kind of diagonally opposite on 12 meridians or so.

Does tango use a mac for his traktor setup? I just downloaded the last build 1.2.7 demo and its not accessible at all. I read on the site that 2 is coming out in april, hopefully some progress there.

Going to dig into the manual anyway to find some shortcut keys perhaps it might take me somewhere.

Best

I am a photographer, but I don't have near enough gadgets.

Not sure on what Tango's using, but I know Lance is on a macs. I don't think there's any accessibility options with Traktor though. You might go through this thread and see if it helps you any.

http://djtechtools.com/forum/showthr...ighlight=Blind

wait, lance is blind? as in recently?

I would suggest consider more physical hardware.

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Originally Posted by sine143

wait, lance is blind? as in recently?

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He's been legally blind for a couple years I think, but can see some stuff up close.

oh damn, cause I was going to say, doesnt he ride a kikker bobber?

Yep, that's the thread that initially made me jump in.

I'm glad to know there are other dudes who are trying just as hard to get something out of the software available out there.

I've been heavily involved in trying to inform developers on the accessibility options available in their developer program such as those for voice over on macs.

One such developer was really helpful and has plugged in the accessibility options from a standard API, and he reckoned it actually gave him far more clarity in the way his interfaces work after having tagged all his elements. A way in brief to facilitate cross linking of classes and such.

If you heard of audio spillage's drum spillage drum synth thats the guy.

Anyway, too bad traktor isn't accessible, but there might be some way to control it via keyboard, with the exception of no audio feedback when manipulating an element on the UI. This can be somewhat resolved with some third party software which map out the coordinates on an interface and plugs commands to them, but they rely on visual cues and take a lot of time to create, are volatile as an interface can easily change from build to build, and there's an overhead in processing which makes the experience less than stellar especially for dynamic applications such as digital deejaying.

Thanks anyway for the help, will keep contacting some of the developers to try to get some accessibility in there.


Best

I hope this doesn't sound ignorant, because I am actually interested in how someone who cannot see can type. Do you have a braille keyboard? Or voice recognition software?

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Originally Posted by deviantdigi

I would suggest consider more physical hardware.

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As for the traktor pro, I think a very tactile controller would be the best, one you can get used to quite easily.

Like the M-Audio Trigger Finger....it has great pads and faders and knobs. Works for me.

Best!

Hey Triple7...

Welcome to the DJTT Crew, you're definitely in the right place!

There are loads of super cool, highly intelligent and extremely helpful people here at DJTechTools.

If I run across anything on my search and destroy missions, I'll hook you up.

Also, I'm certain you'll obtain immense success in your endeavors to expand your horizons.

DJTT is a Talent Magnet and "The" Massive Resource of Everything Awesome.

This is the Spot and we're glad you're here.

Blind users operate with a screen reader which reads aloud where in the interface you are. You navigate with the keyboard or the trackpad in certain instances. That's where all the synthetic voices you hear on some mixes come from. If you got a mac, just press command f5 or fn command f5 and you will have the screen reader on. Don't know if you remember the stuff from madlib or some brainfeeder mixes, but if you press control option command right or left arrow with voice over on, you hear a category which is voices, then control option command up or downa arrow and you'll hear some pretty novel voices such as zarvox or pipe organ. Just open a text editor and type whatever text you want, and it'll read it for you with those voices. Some are truly creepy but others rather cool and can be used on podcasts and such.

Oh wow, I had no idea. That's pretty cool.

Triple7 you humble me. I take so much for granted.

As you were saying, in changing the UI no sound is made-- Traktor functions the same regardless of the UI, it just hides and shows things visually, so that shouldn't matter much. The only thing you really need is a way of reading the browser (for track selection), other than that I'd suggest using DVS and doing everything else by ear (I'm assuming you know how). You could use the X1's FX shortcuts, and not even need to read the FX section.

I think the X1 with it's native mapping is the best choice.

Hey triple7

If you decide to use traktor I can say with my little bit of experience that it will work even though there will be no screen reader response. The only problem that will arise is the fact that you will need someone with sight to help you map the controls and go through the initial set up.

I use itunes to manage my playlists and organise my music so its just a matter of scrolling down the tree via hotkey untill I hit the playlist I want. To verify I have the right playlist I recorded myself saying what playlist it is and put that file at the very top, play it through the monitor channel and its confirmed.

I agree that the more tacktile you can get the easier it will be. The x1 is great, the layout is easy to navigate, the buttons are large and it is difficult to accedently press one or move a knob because they click into place.

If you have anyother questions feel free to ask and I will do what I can to help.

I didn't even know this was possible... How do you DJ without being able to see what you're doing? Seriously, I am mystified :eek:

Tripple7- all the more props to you my friend :)

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Originally Posted by Villinus

I didn't even know this was possible... How do you DJ without being able to see what you're doing? Seriously, I am mystified :eek:

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I had to think on this one for a while, it is just second nature to me now, kind of like how I know I am in a hallway by hearing the airflow.

Speaking for myself, I cannot answer for Triple7 or Lance, I just know how my software is mapped. The hours of practice help to do this and its just like using a keyboard to type when you dont look at the keys.

Pushing Traktor to its limits and making mistakes is helpfull, that way I know the software limits and how to get out of a screwup real quick.

Reading the crowd is hard, but I havent had to much experience. It is all about using my other senses to tell me whats going on, feeling vibrations in the floor as people dance, listening to the crowd moving.

I could go on, I hope this sheds some light on your question.

WHOA!!

Thread has blown me any!

Much respect!

Talk about having to trust your software and hardware rig!

Awesome DJTT!!!!

Threads like this make the saying my parents always told me feel true: "If there is a will, there is a way."

As JonathanBlake put it, this is truly humbling, and I am really glad you came to DJTT. I remember seeing Tango's original post (forwarded by B3nz0n8) over here and I would truly one day love to hear either (or both :)) of you guys's mixes!

Welcome to the crew :)!

Much respect, indeed!

Tango,
I love the part where you tell to use your other senses to feel the audience and to know what your software is doing.
I really think that we only push our senses to the max when we lose one of them.

I will try to mix with my eyes closed just to feel what you guys feel when playing :)

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Originally Posted by Tango 179

I had to think on this one for a while, it is just second nature to me now, kind of like how I know I am in a hallway by hearing the airflow.

Speaking for myself, I cannot answer for Triple7 or Lance, I just know how my software is mapped. The hours of practice help to do this and its just like using a keyboard to type when you dont look at the keys.

Pushing Traktor to its limits and making mistakes is helpfull, that way I know the software limits and how to get out of a screwup real quick.

Reading the crowd is hard, but I havent had to much experience. It is all about using my other senses to tell me whats going on, feeling vibrations in the floor as people dance, listening to the crowd moving.

I could go on, I hope this sheds some light on your question.

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Fantastic! Good to know that if my vision ever goes*, I'll still be able to do what I love :)


*knock on wood

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Originally Posted by Coldfuzion

I remember seeing Tango's original post (forwarded by B3nz0n8) over here and I would truly one day love to hear either (or both :)) of you guys's mixes!

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Once I get all my gear together and practice with it for a while I will definatly share a mix or two. Might be a while though still looking for a job to pay for my gear...

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Originally Posted by V-Hoff

Tango,
I love the part where you tell to use your other senses to feel the audience and to know what your software is doing.
I really think that we only push our senses to the max when we lose one of them.

I will try to mix with my eyes closed just to feel what you guys feel when playing

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Very true, I never knew just how strong my other senses were untill I lost my sight. Reading a crowd without sight is something else, though I am reading things when I am on the dancefloor and not in the booth. That will come in time I guess. BTW the white blind id cane gets me lots of attention when dancing.

Let me know how you do mixing with your eyes closed, I am interested in hearing your thoughts, or anyone else who tries to mix blindfolded.

Yeah.....I guess I could get away with DJing on my rig with my eyes closed....but thats cuz i can picture it. Already know what it looks like.

But what if you have never seen before.....that must be hectic.

You will most probably form your own picture of it in your mind after some use etc.

WOW....damn interesting thread this.

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Originally Posted by sarasin

Yeah.....I guess I could get away with DJing on my rig with my eyes closed....but thats cuz i can picture it. Already know what it looks like.

But what if you have never seen before.....that must be hectic.

You will most probably form your own picture of it in your mind after some use etc.

WOW....damn interesting thread this.

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You are dead on, I form a map of the things I use, a midi controller would be no different when it comes to forming the mental map. With practice I can form a fairly compleate mental image of a room or item fairly quickly. I must admit though it is not always easy or straight forward.

I am planning on putting small tacktile markers on my gear to note the most often used/important buttons to make them easy to find when in a rush.

If anyone has anyother questions feel free to ask, dont mind sharing my experiences.

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Originally Posted by Tango 179

You are dead on, I form a map of the things I use, a midi controller would be no different when it comes to forming the mental map. With practice I can form a fairly compleate mental image of a room or item fairly quickly. I must admit though it is not always easy or straight forward.

I am planning on putting small tacktile markers on my gear to note the most often used/important buttons to make them easy to find when in a rush.

If anyone has anyother questions feel free to ask, dont mind sharing my experiences.

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I have a redundant M-Audio X-Session Pro - would it be of any use to you? - I'll ship it to you. Pics/video please.

Tango,

I know that a video would have no use for you, but can you - or better do you want - to ask a friend to film you mixing techniques?

That would be epic, it should even turn into a DJTT article, I know that would be trully inspiring for some DJs that are tired of playing and even better, maybe there are some blind people that would love to be a DJ but are demotivated to even start it.

Someone should write an article about this. Ean please???

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Originally Posted by JonathanBlake

I have a redundant M-Audio X-Session Pro - would it be of any use to you? - I'll ship it to you. Pics/video please.

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Awsome I love the generosity here. I will send you a pm.

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Originally Posted by V-Hoff

Tango,

I know that a video would have no use for you, but can you - or better do you want - to ask a friend to film you mixing techniques?

That would be epic, it should even turn into a DJTT article, I know that would be trully inspiring for some DJs that are tired of playing and even better, maybe there are some blind people that would love to be a DJ but are demotivated to even start it.

Someone should write an article about this. Ean please???

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Interesting idea, I will see about putting a video together once I get my gear and have had some practice. Hmm an article on this, sounds like another interesting idea. I would be glad to help provide info for one.

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Originally Posted by Tango 179

Interesting idea, I will see about putting a video together once I get my gear and have had some practice. Hmm an article on this, sounds like another interesting idea. I would be glad to help provide info for one.

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i´m sure everyone would embrace the idea of an article!