Making beats: starting from scratch vs using pre-made loops

This is a question I've had for a while now, and I'm not sure if its actually a good question, or an incredibly obvious stupid question. Before I even thought about getting into DJing, step 1 was to fool around with Garage Band that came with my mac. Well that quickly turned into around 30 or so tracks but instantly got me thinking about loops. When using Garage Band one is instantly set up with a vast library of various loops. So naturally I took advantage of this, almost exclusively when it comes to beats. For me beats are pretty complex; its easy to write a melody or a bass line, but getting good drum grooves can be tricky. Almost immediately it got me thinking: what is the general view on using pre-made drum loops or sounds in your tracks? Is this frowned upon as being essentially "cheating"? Would one ever be taken seriously layering pre-made drum loops to make a groove as opposed to creating every individual sound for yourself, or worse selling your music only to find out these loops are subject to copyright laws?

My natural instinct is to think that yes, this would be frowned upon because to me this is by far the hardest part of making a track (hence why I think this might be a really stupid question). And yet I've seen no shortage of add-on packs and loops for Logic and Abelton (but why I think this might actually be a legit question after all). I'm now on the verge of getting back into the producing side, this time on Ableton (god help me) and I want to do this right. Layering pre-made drum sounds would save me a ton of time and hassle if it's legit, however getting good at creating them from scratch would obviously be a great skill to have. Any thoughts?

Most people wouldn't be hugely impressed if you use purely sample pack loops on their own, without modifying or adding anything. It's not illegal to use them, assuming you buy them from a retailer that has 'royalty free loops' though, and integrating them into your tracks and adding things is extremely common. More importantly though, using them plain will make your music sound bland/generic, which is the real reason you need to learn about drums, even if you don't have a talent for them.

If you're wondering how pros tend to include loops/breaks in their tracks, check out Rusko's masterclass, which I've linked, or Subfocus's masterclass, both of which explain how layering breaks over your track can help. These are also an excellent starting point for learning a bit more about making kick-ass drums. They don't rely on them for drum quality though, trying to use loops exclusively is a crutch that will weaken your tracks. http://vimeo.com/3595144

Ableton isn't too bad to figure out, there's an infinity of amazing tutorials that will help you out. Just do the in program tutorials, read the manual, then look around for anything specific you're trying to do.

everyone uses loops....everyone

premade loops are boring as all hell, but thats just me, do what feels right to you

Depends on what you do with loops. they can be manipulated in many different ways. There is no right of wrong way. Whatever sounds good in the end is the rule. Too many think about silly shit like this rather than just getting into it.

alright cool, thanks for the responses guys!

I know a lot of professionals that make use of pre-made drum loops. Some of them take the hybrid path and combine pre-made shaker loops or something like that with their one kick and snare beats created from one shot samples.
On the other hand creating your own drum loops gives your music much more uniqueness and might improve the overall quality as (when only working with pre-canned loops) one might tend to go with a not really fitting drum loop in lack of a better option after minutes and hours of search.

I personally prefer to do it all on my own. My signature kick and snare even is not taken from standard sample packs but created by myself. Of course, this all takes some time but it's the only way to be perfectly satisfied in the end, in my opinion.

And I can imagine it's hard to create beats if you don't own a "real instrument" (midi-controller) but just try to program everything with your mouse. If that's how you have done it till now I would hardly recommend a small midi-controller or midi-keyboard that lets you rather feel and play your music and makes it MUCH more easy to set up a nice drum groove. I use Maschine a lot which is even more recommendable. But starting with a 50$-midi-controller would already be a great improvement!

It has taken me exactly 20 years to collect all my drums sounds.

Sampled just about every drum machine out there in existance that I could beg steal and borrow. Plus sampled the shitnuzz out my huge, huge vinyl collection, not just the breaks but single hits.

Its the back bone of all my productions....... all in easy to find directories as well.. years and years of work.

But thats my sound... we had to do it the oldskool way. If ya starting out I would find a pre made loop you like and then try to mimic it by single hits... you will leran then.

The are gillions of free sample packs out there....... go have fun!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Tommi Bass

It has taken me exactly 20 years to collect all my drums sounds.

Sampled just about every drum machine out there in existance that I could beg steal and borrow. Plus sampled the shitnuzz out my huge, huge vinyl collection, not just the breaks but single hits.

Its the back bone of all my productions....... all in easy to find directories as well.. years and years of work.

But thats my sound... we had to do it the oldskool way. If ya starting out I would find a pre made loop you like and then try to mimic it by single hits... you will leran then.

The are gillions of free sample packs out there....... go have fun!

---

Sweet! What kind of sampler/environment do you use? Do you beatslice, or just cut up, or what?

I've done both and if you know your way around Ableton or any other DAW.....there are times you sample and sidechain to really get the sound you want.....and there are times you have an inspiration and can manipulate the sound using just what you have.

Watch Avicii's Masterclass with Future Music. 100% sample loops for the drums except the kick and clap. And I'm sure he's not the only one. So say what you will about Avicii, but one thing is certain: you don't HAVE to make your own drum patterns to be successful.

At the end of the day it's about what sounds good and works well for you. I prefer to program mine, but I do basically everything in MIDI except FX.

Usually I use drum loops. Sometimes I can't be bothered to find that one beat that I want. They don't take a lot of time to make.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Tommi Bass

It has taken me exactly 20 years to collect all my drums sounds.

Sampled just about every drum machine out there in existance that I could beg steal and borrow. Plus sampled the shitnuzz out my huge, huge vinyl collection, not just the breaks but single hits.

Its the back bone of all my productions....... all in easy to find directories as well.. years and years of work.

But thats my sound... we had to do it the oldskool way. If ya starting out I would find a pre made loop you like and then try to mimic it by single hits... you will leran then.

The are gillions of free sample packs out there....... go have fun!

---

Do you release your song commercially? I always wanted to sample from song like that but am worried about legal problem that might arise... not that I'm a big artist but still

BOTH

i highly suggest finding a loop you like and deconstruct it. that way you'll learn how make a groove and, really understand it, it will give you a better understanding when making your own loops. like many have mentioned layering loops on original drums, hell i've sampled a drum loop from a record, beefed it up with my own kicks, snares etc. and then layered another pre-made loop over it. there really are no rules. i feel like the guys who get upset are the ones that didn't think of it.

that being said, if your whole track is comprised of pre made loops, (bass, pads, leads, drums) do you really feel proud of it at the end of the day? I used to use Acid, and even my Maschine has a load of stock loops that I do make use of, but it's not just about that. If it sounds good, feels right then by all means go ahead.

One of my things I used to do, and should get into the happen of doing again, is just making drum loops. I used to sit in front of Acid Pro for HOURS just making drums loops, with different variations. Sometimes i sampled, sometimes they were all original, then save them as wav files, so when a bass line/melody/chord progression came to me I could quickly pull up a drum loop with 4-8 variations on it, and almost bang out a whole song.