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Ch-ch-check it out
http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/...0OU01S20140903
DISCUSS
Where will this business unit land? Who will buy it? Will it become a standalone business? Is this Pioneer forecasting the eventual downfall in popularity of DJing in general?
I had the pleasure to meet the president of Pioneer DJ Latin America, at the launch of the CDJ-2000Nexus in the São Paulo EXPOMUSIC 2012. I came prepared with an iPhone with Rekordbox installed and music analysed, ready to play. I was the only person to come to the Pioneer stand prepared like this. I got very surprised to see that not only the Pioneer staff but also the president weren't able to make everything work!
Some people might say iPhones + CDJs is not a relevant thing to discuss but it very alarming to see a president of a company not knowing how to make his own product work!
On that moment I realised that something was very wrong inside Pioneer, and then started to make the jump to DJ-Softwares.
It is a common thing that Presidents/CEOs of very large corporations such as Pioneer do not know the intricacies of how their products and software work, that is not surprising. The staff that was actually allowed to attend the Expo were most likely not the engineers who coded the software or even DJs, but outward facing representatives that are there to basically whore our the Pioneer brand, again not surprising at all.
They only rarely let the nerds out to interact with the public at a trade show. I'd be STUNNED if the CEO of any tech company could actually setup and use the tech...but that's not their job. Their job is to interact with the investors and financial markets....and I'd be stunned if any tech nerds could actually do that either.
What was the point of their turntable then?
Yeaaa... CEOs are usually business guys, not engineers.
I can't think of many companies that actually have science guys at the top of the firm, Honda is the only one off the top of my head.
They are selling to Panasonic (Technics), full circle.
Well... one of the things that already alarmed me, was Karl Detken moving from Pioneer to V-Moda.
At that point Pioneer lost their main aorta for the DJ division if you ask me.
woah, the implications to this are pretty huge for the industry
place your bets on who buys them. I'm gonna say Beats By Dre (Apple) :p
so that's what the next event is all about! :pQuote:
Originally Posted by dsquareddan
Denon will buy Pioneer and corner the market!
from an investor standpoint this move sort of makes sense tho. I mean sure the PioneerDJ brand has been successful and profitable, but at what point does it reach peak market saturation? surely it's there now or very close. How much can they continue to grow from here when every club & festival around the planet has a piece of pioneer gear in it that has been shown to last at least 5-10 years of heavy use? The DJ market is only going to get so big. You reach a point where you look to sell off the assets of the division now to turn the most profit as possible.
Just came from another thread with a no-brand Chinese made controller. Pioneer is getting out when the getting is good.
This was reported back in June, and honestly it appears to be Mis-reported.
The article contradicts itself in one line saying that it was selling its assets making losses, and the next line saying their DJ division was profiting - makes no sense whatsoever.
I don't believe Pioneer Pro division is going anywhere just yet TBH, they just released their much upgraded Rekordbox, and best selling DDJ-SX and New Pro headphone line. This does not seem like a move that a company selling a profitable division would bother with.
Of course I could be wrong.
The pioneer staff could not make the iPhone-CDJ connecton work, not just the CEO but anyway....
Pioneer staff sucks in general, the Pioneer forum is pure panic since ever, too many complaints and problems and too little solutions. They delete a lot of threads so it doesn't get too ridiculous. Engineers take weeks, if not months to answer (not even solve) some problem.
Rekordbox is always on the edge to take off and dominate it all but it never does, and never will, because it is surrounded by a hardware that has limited possibilities to evolve.
If I was the main leader of all this I would sell it too, it seems the best option for everybody. The new owner will hopefully fire a lot of people.
Official statement from Pioneer, today:Quote:
Originally Posted by deevey
"Pioneer is currently considering every possible measure with respect to review of its
business portfolio, including sale of DJ equipment business. However, no decisions
have been made. We have no other comments on this matter. "
http://pioneer.jp/press-e/2014/pdf/0904-2.pdf
http://pioneer.jp/index-e.php
Looks like they are only saying they are 'considering it' - which in CEO-speak means it is on the table, regardless of their final decision, it is still interesting they are talking about it, and whatever implications their business decisions in the next year will have on the tech industry.
I love to see pioneer desperate, they deserve it.
Interesting - Onyoko is owned by Gibson, who also own Stanton, KRK and Cerwin Vega so perhaps a resurrection or collaboration with those parties or its highly possible that the Pioneer brand name may be part of the deal and here to stay even if the shares are sold of the various divisions, however I remember seeing something somewhere about Gibsons lack of interest in DJ gear although it was mentioned elsewhere that Barings will potentially own 51% so would be the controlling shareholder :huh:Quote:
Pioneer is currently considering every possible measure with respect to review of its
business portfolio, including sale of DJ equipment business.
Please explain how they "deserve it" ? Just because you don't like them or .....Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniboy
And selling less profitable assets to plough into their more profitable ventures is hardly desperate.
If I remember rightly Automotive A/V makes up something like 70 or 80% of their entire company, they have 30% global market share of car stereos !!!
Pro and home audio are just small splinters in the company.
Yea, I do not like them. Their mixers are ok, just overpriced. Their CDJs get more instable on every launch and their Rekordbox is just lame. But that is not the real problem, a lot of other brands make shitty stuff. What makes me mad is their customer support. They don't solve the customer's problems, they treat you like a freaking homeless asking for coins to buy booze, while you just spent a fortune with their gear!Quote:
Originally Posted by deevey
I don't hate "Pioneer", I have Pioneer automotive stuff, and these things work flawlessly.
I hate "Pioneer DJ", which are clearly very distinct people from automotive Pioneer. And when I say distinct I mean less inteligent.
Well I have my reasons, IMO they spent too much on marketing and too little on technology, now DJ-Softwares are so ahead and there is nothing they can do about it, so they are selling everything.
You sound like an angry spoilt little child. And your anger is clouding your vision and sense of judgement.Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniboy
Pioneer dominates the DJ booth for a reason. And its not because everyone thinks they are cool!! its because their gear works, is simple to use and sticks with a basic, easy to understand, layout. That's the very reason that it is at least 10 years before we will see DJ software as an 'industry standard' club install.
You use the Pioneer forum as a benchmark for the quality of their customer service but that's nuts. People rarely go to a product forum to tell everyone how hunky dorey their equipment is. Its only people with complaints and issues so you will always get a skewed perception. I'm truly sorry if you've had personal bad experiences with Pioneer but that's just shit luck.
http://www.silveryhat.com/fun_pix/da...7066831452.gifQuote:
Originally Posted by kooper1980
>People that complain about Pioneer's prices
More like a child laughing at the situation heheheheQuote:
Originally Posted by kooper1980
Been in this forum badmouthing Rekordbox & Pioneer for a long time, saying they don't know how to make softwares or treat customers.
Now things are bad for them, Its my right to laugh.
You love Pioneer? I give no fucks.
if Allen and Heath knows whats good for them, they will reach VERY DEEP into their pockets and buy them and create a mad monopoly!!
Because...how could any dj resist a combination between those brands :) :) :)
I would like this! A&H seems to know what DJs really needQuote:
Originally Posted by 031999
Quote:
Originally Posted by 031999
pioneers fx with A&H sound and filters? yeah, I'd want one of those mixers in a bad bad way.
Pioneer is actually about 30 minutes down the street from me. What's odd is that it's very common in Japan for the big electronic makers to keep an army of little non-profitable mom&pop electronic stores in business so they can hang their logos over their doors just for the name recognition, so one would think they would want to keep the division for that reason. I don't even know the brand of the stereo in my car. Only time I've seen the pioneer name was on DJ and music gear.
Pioneer had a very profitable past year... things aren't bad for them.Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniboy
It's not about how much money they got last year, its about the future of the market. Of course they got money, they are the absolute leaders (!)Quote:
Originally Posted by SlvrDragon50
I don't see Pioneer dominating it anymore, and I think neither does Pioneer and that's why they are selling it. I never heard about a technique of selling a whole company to make it better and keep it evolving.....
People sell companies because things are about to get bad, because companies that are already on a bad moment don't worth shit.
This is definately not the end, just a structure change, which, IMO, can only be good to Pioneer-DJ's future.
They were a huge name in aftermarket ICE during the 80s and 90s.Quote:
Originally Posted by JaF
I wish NI buy their FX Engine and place it in to some new hybrid controller.
Denon owns A&H.Quote:
Originally Posted by 031999
A&H are a bunch of geniuses in a shed in comparison to the giant that is Pioneer. The 2 are vastly different in size.
Anyhoo I thought Denon (D&M Holdings) sold A&H to UK company called Electra last year.
EDIT: yep, to Electra Private Equity PLC according to Wiki.
If that was even remotely true there wouldn't be any buyers. Kind of like saying people only sell homes that are falling down. Their core business is the car radio market they are saying. If it's true they get more return on investment in that market it could make sense.Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniboy
You should talk to Apple about that 3.2 BILLION Beats acquisition then - I'm sure things were just about to go bad for them too :cool:Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniboy
Minus one genius theses days, I'm afraid. :(Quote:
Originally Posted by Karlos Santos
exactly!!Quote:
Originally Posted by deevey
I think the future looks uncertain for Pioneer DJ. There's been a standard and I think everyone knows CDJ's days are without a doubt numbered, but what will come next? Will there be a standard, like before, or will clubs have to cater for a more dynamic set up where Dj's will be bringing different controllers and software? Will there ever be a single software that wins out and becomes the definitive in a sort of VHS/betamax way?
It doesn't seem likely that clubs will ever adopt a single all in one controller like the DDJ-SX, but perhaps a modular version that caters for Serato/Traktor and USB. Pioneer had the right idea with their mixers having a USB, but in the future they will need 2 x USB (I thought they did, but seems to be just 1). It needs a company to take the bull by the horns and find a way, by working with both Traktor & Serato, to create some modular hardware that can simply integrate with both for simple changeovers, as well as using the gear traditionally with USB, not CDJ. Easier said than done I guess, but Pioneer are best placed to take the lead and make it happen.
Andy ? One of the nicest guys I ever met in the industry. Only met him twice but ... throughly nice fella... and a genius with no doubt.Quote:
Originally Posted by happydan