SPL ratings between JBL and RCF

Looking into getting the RCF 745A to replace my JBL system with something that gets higher SPL and is just overall higher quality. Also, it will match my other RCF stuff. (Mrx 500 series with crown xti 4000)
Anyways, stopped in on my friend working the large room at a hall to see his glow stick party turned out 1300 kids.
He had two JBL pro 725s on stage and nothing else. Granted it was not as loud as it had to be and I heard some distortion, but he was keeping up. I didn't feel like I had to run him some more equipment. I looked up the rating and it says they are rated for 139db

The rcf 745 is rated for 133db, but a video I watched of the red rep at a trade show said they got 136db out of "that box"

I know the 745 will sound clearer, but does RCF "underrate" and JBL "overrate" or does the jbl speake really sound 1.5 times as loud as the 745a?

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Originally Posted by Entheos406

Looking into getting the RCF 745A to replace my JBL system with something that gets higher SPL and is just overall higher quality. Also, it will match my other RCF stuff. (Mrx 500 series with crown xti 4000)
Anyways, stopped in on my friend working the large room at a hall to see his glow stick party turned out 1300 kids.
He had two JBL pro 725s on stage and nothing else. Granted it was not as loud as it had to be and I heard some distortion, but he was keeping up. I didn't feel like I had to run him some more equipment. I looked up the rating and it says they are rated for 139db

The rcf 745 is rated for 133db, but a video I watched of the red rep at a trade show said they got 136db out of "that box"

I know the 745 will sound clearer, but does RCF "underrate" and JBL "overrate" or does the jbl speake really sound 1.5 times as loud as the 745a?

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man those RCF's are so overpriced. $1500 EACH speaker for a 700W RMS plastic box?

I personally love to have 2 smaller tops and a subwoofer. But if you love the 15" tops you should consider listening to the Yamaha DXR15's. Half the price of the RCF's and you get the same 700W RMS power. The Yamaha's are a better looking speaker too.


http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/cont...=REG&A=details

I've heard this RCF sub is bangin'

Has anyone had a chance to listen to it live?

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produc...l/prm/alsVwDtl

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Originally Posted by loverocket

man those RCF's are so overpriced. $1500 EACH speaker for a 700W RMS plastic box?

I personally love to have 2 smaller tops and a subwoofer. But if you love the 15" tops you should consider listening to the Yamaha DXR15's. Half the price of the RCF's and you get the same 700W RMS power. The Yamaha's are a better looking speaker too.


http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/cont...=REG&A=details

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The RCF has a 4" voice coil on its compression driver and crosses over at 650hz instead of 1700hz like most two way boxes. Check it out. The Yamaha has a 1" voice could on its compression driver. No comparison. Kinda ironic that the whole point of the post was to cut through marketing hype and I got a watts vs watts response.
Some companies inflate their wattage numbers. Others keep it real. My question is: does JBL inflate their SPL numbers? I know the RCF will sound noticeable clearer, but as far as loudness is concerned will the RCF keep up with the JBL's claimed 139DB?

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Originally Posted by loverocket

I've heard this RCF sub is bangin'

Has anyone had a chance to listen to it live?

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produc...l/prm/alsVwDtl

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I own the 18" version of that sub. While it is nice, I'm upgrading to their 8004AS.

I was subbing for my friend at a nightclub and brought my system with one sub708as and we had that thing hitting so hard it was shaking my jaw and my forehead when the bass line fluxed during GDFR. Crowd of about 300 on ST paddy's day.

So for a start you're comparing the Single 15" RCF to the Dual 15" JBL. It's going to go louder by virtue of it being able to push more air, and it will probably go deeper as well. I'm not going to say that it'll sound better by any stretch but in all honesty you'd be better off going with a pair of ART735's and trying to get a deal on a 4PRO8003AS to go under them ... and in the long run getting another 4PRO8003AS to really keep up with the ART735's. Reason for ART735's instead of the 745's, they sound more balanced as a stand-a-lone box and give very similar results to the 745's when used with subs. The 745's have quite a bit of bark to their top end and are more suited to be used with subs all the time.

Other than that, not sure how the RCF HD32's are priced where you are but they have some serious poke for a 12" box and match up well with the 4PRO8003 under them. Smaller boxes so easier to move around and still give very decent results by themselves.

I see the days of just using a pair of 15" & horns are drawing to an end because you can get better sound and manageability out of smaller tops and a sub ... I'd take a pair of 10" & horn tops with a single 15" sub any day of the week over a pair of 15" & horns (for example, the ART710A's with ART905AS sub), but it sounds like you want to eventually have a larger system and so the 15" tops will scale up well with some decent 18" subs under them.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Entheos406

The RCF has a 4" voice coil on its compression driver and crosses over at 650hz instead of 1700hz like most two way boxes. Check it out. The Yamaha has a 1" voice could on its compression driver. No comparison. Kinda ironic that the whole point of the post was to cut through marketing hype and I got a watts vs watts response.
Some companies inflate their wattage numbers. Others keep it real. My question is: does JBL inflate their SPL numbers? I know the RCF will sound noticeable clearer, but as far as loudness is concerned will the RCF keep up with the JBL's claimed 139DB?

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listen to the Yamahas if you get a chance.

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Originally Posted by loverocket

listen to the Yamahas if you get a chance.

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I had the Yamaha club series and was tired of old ladies telling me turn it down. When I upgraded to JBL and RCF people could still hold a conversation while the music was playing. There is a dealer in town that has Yamaha so if they have this model I will listen but when I think of Yamaha I think of getting bitten in the eardrum.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Entheos406

I had the Yamaha club series and was tired of old ladies telling me turn it down. When I upgraded to JBL and RCF people could still hold a conversation while the music was playing. There is a dealer in town that has Yamaha so if they have this model I will listen but when I think of Yamaha I think of getting bitten in the eardrum.

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People and brands. So strange.

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Originally Posted by loverocket

People and brands. So strange.

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How do you figure? I owned Yamaha club series and behringer speakers and they sounded awful. I traded up for some higher end JBL and some entry level RCF and have noticed an increase in clarity and a reduction in white noise.
Rather than saying:

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Originally Posted by loverocket

People and brands. So strange.

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How about responding to my concern that one of Yamaha's most popular products sounds like ass?

"one of Yamaha's most popular products sounds like ass" because it's made of cheap components stuffed into a box design that hasn't changed in what, 20 or 30 years? It also is a passive box and so you are relying on the amplifier that you use and most of the time with cheap speakers comes a cheap amp.
As a wise person once said, "you can't polish a turd" ...

This is my method for checking out speakers before I buy them.

Find companies who use them. Go to an event where they are being used. LISTEN TO THEM. Then decide.

There's a reason why I prefer QSC and Bose speakers. It's not because of the price. It's because of how they sound.

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Originally Posted by Bassline Brine

This is my method for checking out speakers before I buy them.

Find companies who use them. Go to an event where they are being used. LISTEN TO THEM. Then decide.

There's a reason why I prefer QSC and Bose speakers. It's not because of the price. It's because of how they sound.

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The problem with your theory is that sound companies have engineers tweaking the sound.

Sometimes you won't be able to reproduce that.

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Originally Posted by frankle

"one of Yamaha's most popular products sounds like ass" because it's made of cheap components stuffed into a box design that hasn't changed in what, 20 or 30 years? It also is a passive box and so you are relying on the amplifier that you use and most of the time with cheap speakers comes a cheap amp.
As a wise person once said, "you can't polish a turd" ...

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Yamaha Clubs are classic speakers. My friend has 4 at his warehouse running off a Crown and they are solid.

They play loud and clean. And the price is nice.

Of course you can pay more and get a better rig, but for the price they are great.

http://www.funktion-one.com/dl/files...ide%20v1.1.pdf

See Appendix C on page 57. SPL ratings for speakers are nearly meaningless. Shop for sensitivity. If they don't list sensitivity, it's probably because it isn't good.

Sensitivity is only relevant in passive speakers.

SPL ratings are relevant for powered speakers.

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Originally Posted by loverocket

Sensitivity is only relevant in passive speakers.

SPL ratings are relevant for powered speakers.

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http://sound.westhost.com/articles/pa.htm

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Originally Posted by Be0

http://sound.westhost.com/articles/pa.htm

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Like I said before

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Originally Posted by Entheos406

How do you figure? I owned Yamaha club series and behringer speakers and they sounded awful. I traded up for some higher end JBL and some entry level RCF and have noticed an increase in clarity and a reduction in white noise.
Rather than saying:

How about responding to my concern that one of Yamaha's most popular products sounds like ass?

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Yamaha Club series are old. They are targeted for basic no frills money conscious consumers.

Yamaha bought Nexo around 5 years ago and the are using that R&D in developing their new stuff.

RCF is great but I think they are overpriced. The Yamaha DXRs are ridiculous for the price. They sound like $2000 boxes from 10 years ago for $600.

I think the RCF's sound like $1000 boxes for $1400. I think the Yamahas sound like $1000 boxes for $600.

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Originally Posted by Bassline Brine

There's a reason why I prefer QSC and Bose speakers.

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This 100 times over. It surprises me how many people just overlook, don't know/care about, or for whatever reason, don't get QSC. They are loud, high quality speakers, with an amazing warranty and customer service. Honestly, none of the other companies touch them as far as 2 way powered speakers and subs go in that price range.

That said, you look at how many people have bought KRK monitors for their home studio when most stores have a pair of Yamahas right next to them, ready to demo... people buy what they hear is best rather than listening for what is the best.

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Originally Posted by sobi

It surprises me how many people just overlook, don't know/care about, or for whatever reason, don't get QSC. They are loud, high quality speakers, with an amazing warranty and customer service. Honestly, none of the other companies touch them as far as 2 way powered speakers and subs go in that price range.

That said, you look at how many people have bought KRK monitors for their home studio when most stores have a pair of Yamahas right next to them, ready to demo... people buy what they hear is best rather than listening for what is the best.

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It's ironic how you say that none of the other companies touch QSC as far as 2-way speakers go, yet the QSC K-series (pre-K.2) are known to be overrated and overhyped, albeit with a good warranty. As are the KRK monitors you mentioned in the following post saying how no one goes for the Yamahas even though they are probably technically better.

I had QSC K12s but I slowly replaced them with DXR12s after being impressed with the DXR15s (I have never traditionally been a fan of 15" woofer and horn combos but the DXR15s were an exception)
The DXR12s not only go slightly louder, but they maintain composure doing so and stay smooth and detailed with much less fatigue (brilliant DSP thanks to NEXO I'm guessing)
I was also able to make a profit off my K12's as they are sought after, the Apple of the PA world (or KRK :p); not necessarily the best, but reliable enough, kinda overpriced and very popular.

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Originally Posted by Entheos406

I had the Yamaha club series and was tired of old ladies telling me turn it down. When I upgraded to JBL and RCF people could still hold a conversation while the music was playing. There is a dealer in town that has Yamaha so if they have this model I will listen but when I think of Yamaha I think of getting bitten in the eardrum.

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I owned a Behringer Eurolive analogue desk and it sounded like rubbish so that tells me that the X32 is rubbish...
??

The Club series is a very old line up, comparable in price/performance to the budget JBL JRX boxes. Not great, but they're ok. How can you say all Macs are crap if the only one you used was an entry-level 2006 plastic-model MacBook? The DXRs are fantastic speakers and amazing bang/buck. The only way you can determine how good a speaker is, is by going into a store, playing a selection of your songs and asking the staff to allow you to turn them up to near limit, see how they handle when things get LOUD. It's the reason I went with DXR over some more QSC. I wouldn't have known any better if not for my own judgements. :thumbup: