Numark 4Trak - how portable?

Hi

I'm trying to decide on a new Traktor Pro controller and it's down to the Denon DN-MC6000 and the Numark 4Trak.

My preferred option is probably the 4Trak because of build quality and button layout, but I'm a little worried about how easy it's going to be to lug around. I have gigs I have to take the train to, and then travel across London by tube etc., and the 4Trak just looks like a really big unit, and heavy too. Also can't find many bags that will take it, and practically none that will carry the controller and a 17" Macbook.

Can any 4Trak users perhaps advise on how things are working out for them? Is the extra size and weight a problem, or are there ways to get around it? I don't mind a bit of physical effort, as long as the whole thing isn't so unweildy that it's just unworkable.

Thanks in advance for any feedback. Really excited about this purchase!

Jules

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Originally Posted by Trailerman

Hi

I'm trying to decide on a new Traktor Pro controller and it's down to the Denon DN-MC6000 and the Numark 4Trak.

My preferred option is probably the 4Trak because of build quality and button layout, but I'm a little worried about how easy it's going to be to lug around. I have gigs I have to take the train to, and then travel across London by tube etc., and the 4Trak just looks like a really big unit, and heavy too. Also can't find many bags that will take it, and practically none that will carry the controller and a 17" Macbook.

Can any 4Trak users perhaps advise on how things are working out for them? Is the extra size and weight a problem, or are there ways to get around it? I don't mind a bit of physical effort, as long as the whole thing isn't so unweildy that it's just unworkable.

Thanks in advance for any feedback. Really excited about this purchase!

Jules

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Hi dude, I've just got one a few days ago. Although it's quite big, it's not too heavy. If you buy the backpack it shouldn't be too bad. It's a great piece of equipment though and I fully recommend it. Nearest controller to CDJ's I've ever come across.

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Originally Posted by joemanton

Hi dude, I've just got one a few days ago. Although it's quite big, it's not too heavy. If you buy the backpack it shouldn't be too bad. It's a great piece of equipment though and I fully recommend it. Nearest controller to CDJ's I've ever come across.

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That's extremely helpful. Glad to hear you're pleased with it - it looks superb.

It looks like there's a Numark bag that will hold it, so I'd just need a way to carry the laptop, stand, phones etc. I just want to make sure it's physically possible to carry the kit around when I need to.

Thanks again.

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Originally Posted by Trailerman

That's extremely helpful. Glad to hear you're pleased with it - it looks superb.

It looks like there's a Numark bag that will hold it, so I'd just need a way to carry the laptop, stand, phones etc. I just want to make sure it's physically possible to carry the kit around when I need to.

Thanks again.

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No problem.

There's a front pocket that should fit your macbook in.

i've played with an MC6000 and while i love Denon, the mc6000 is way too tiny for me. and everything seems smooshed together

4Trak layout is interesting. Depending where you'll use it, it may not fit in the DJ booth at all though.

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Originally Posted by Steve Zorilow

4Trak layout is interesting. Depending where you'll use it, it may not fit in the DJ booth at all though.

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Originally Posted by no_rex4u

i've played with an MC6000 and while i love Denon, the mc6000 is way too tiny for me. and everything seems smooshed together

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And there you have it. One's too big, one's too small. The Denon could have been sized up about 10% and the Numark sized down by the same amount. I love the button and knob configuration on the 4Trak, and the spacious feel is cool, plus the build quality is by all accounts amazing, but all the time I'm thinking - "mate, you've got to drag this thing home later".

The portability of the Denon would be a huge benefit - it'll practically fit in a large laptop bag - but there's a nagging voice in my head saying "too small, you'll regret compromising on control layout for the sake of a smaller bag". I'm just shit at decisions basically.

Somebody please help me ....!! :001_unsure: :001_unsure:

Appreciate all the feedback guys.

Jules

Get the 4Trak, it's worth it.

If not - then the S4 is very similar and about 15% smaller than the 4Trak (at a guess).

never had to transport it anywhere but its not too heavy. build quality is FAR better than expected with a numark and leaps and bounds above the s4. every button works, is mapped correctly and can take a fair amount of abuse. flux mode and 3rd party maps all work with zero problems. sound card is solid. analog/digital is nice to have.
if your putting any decent controller in a bag with a lap top...they're all going to feel about the same on your back.

The VCI 400 is in between the size of the S4 and MC6000, and is also a solid well built controller.

Having had the S4 for a couple years I can tell you now it's not something you'd want to carry around regularly on your back, especially not on the tube. And the 4TRAK is bigger and heavier..

Edit: Wow, the 4TRAK is over twice the weight of the S4?? :scared:

On sizing, I have to point out that the problem with the 4trak is not the weight, it's the same problem with all all-in-one controllers: stage space. Setting them up is awful, especially for the DJs on before and after you. EVERY real DJ-oriented gig has CDJs and a mixer set up in the center of the stage, so even if you can set up an all-in-one, it's off to the side and awkward. It's not worth it. Much better to figure out how to incorporate the gear already on stage at events, so that you can make your workflow possible without being horribly intrusive. The HID mode on the CDJ2000's and the sound card in the DJM-900 are great for this. There's no reason to set up a controller with jog wheels and a mixer if there are already jogwheels and a mixer on stage, just figure out how to use standard gear and buy modular controllers to supplement it, if you do things you can't do with the regularly available gear.

For instance if you want cue points, buy a small button controller like a midi fighter. if you want effects control, buy something with knobs. If you want to use four decks, buy modular deck controllers like the CMD PL-1/Reloop Contour and set them up alongside the provided gear.

I did the all-in-one thing for a while, and found that it's a terrible idea, unless you're either a famous producer, or a new DJ playing gigs that don't have standard equipment. I can't tell you how many times I've fucked up the DJ before or after me while trying to set up or tear down just a simple S4. Not worth it. With just a sound card, I've found literally ANY advantage of an all-in-one setup easily and cheaply replicable with simple supplemental controllers, and whatever gear the event has. (any CDJs, and/or turntables, and any mixer)

Yup, audio interface + X1 is what I've switched to myself. Getting a timecode compatible interface lets you use the older CDJs that don't support HID.

Although there are times where equipement is not provided - for that case I'd go for a more compact 2-deck all in one that doesn't break your back hauling it around.

Definitely, but an all-in-one should never be your main setup, unless, as previously mentioned, you are a famous producer, or a newbie DJ playing exclusively bar gigs and the like.

Companies are making a killing right now on these all-in-one's though, because newbies and bedroom DJs don't realize how impractical they are at real gigs. Hopefully that will stop soon.

after reading this thread I am fully expecting the OP to give us an update stating: "i found the perfect solution guys. I bought a scooter so I don't have to take the 4 Trak on the train."

... I wish!!

No I'm still sitting on the fence I'm afraid, but I really need to take the plunge.

Interesting points above re. practicality of all-in-ones in general when you're playing out. All points totally taken, but to be honest are not totally relevant to the decision in hand. My professional DJ'ing days are long behind me - I played regularly up until about 10 years go, but it was always vinyl, so the only gear I ever took with me was headphones and my crates.

I'm now a TV composer, and DJ'ing is limited to parties, launches, promotional stuff, private events etc., so it's largely for fun, peanuts or beers, and I'm generally the only one playing, or if there are more of us, we can usually plan gear arrangements ahead. As such, any of the controllers under consideration will do just fine.

Makar - I'll hold my hands up and say I'm prejudice against Vestax. I have memories of some pretty poor mixers, and the dreadful decks they launched when they were trying to move in on the 1210 market. That said, I will give it a look, although it looks like sizewise it's very similar to the Denon.

So .... we're pretty much back where we started. Has anyone tried carrying the 4Trak around to gigs? Next time I'm playing is down in London in 2 weeks time = car+train+tube/taxi, then back in reverse, and much as I'm totally in love with the 4Trak, the sensible part of my brain is telling me that the MC-6000 makes more sense, and I'll get used to the slightly cramped feel and smaller jog-wheels in time.

Still hugely grateful for any and all help and feedback.

Jules

Dj Subculture here on the forums has had both, so you could ask him how he compares the Denon MC6000 and Vestax VCI400:

http://forum.djtechtools.com/showthread.php?t=68347

I recently picked up a VCI 100 myself and it's the most solid controller I've used so far - much better built than the 3 S4s I've had..

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Originally Posted by makar1

Dj Subculture here on the forums has had both, so you could ask him how he compares the Denon MC6000 and Vestax VCI400:

http://forum.djtechtools.com/showthread.php?t=68347

I recently picked up a VCI 100 myself and it's the most solid controller I've used so far - much better built than the 3 S4s I've had..

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You have the VCI-100 MK2 ? You prefer the VCI-100 over the S4 ?

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I have the Mk1, as I already have enough audio interfaces and got it for a good price. I definitely prefer the build quality of the VCI100 over the S4.

All in one

Bright side:

• Name says it all, only one piece of gear to carry, plug, take care of.
• Really quick setup time

Not so bright

• May don't fit every DJ booth
• In case of problem, all your setup may suffer
• Depending your style, you may still need to add external controller/soundcard

Modular

Bright side:

• 100% custom workflow/ergonomy
• You can add, remove, change controller anytime to fit tighter DJ booth or while travelling
• Less problematic if a unit become defective, you an still use the other, modify mapping on the fly
• Usually cheaper to change some part of your setup OR to get some backup one VS an All-In-One

Not so bright

• Longer or WAY longer setup time
• More susceptible to those "Oh crap, I forgot this adapter, hub, wire" moments
• More weak points that could affect "stability" in harsh environment with cheaper wiring/hubs/power bar/...

Modular for me in most gig. Discuss...

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Originally Posted by makar1

I have the Mk1, as I already have enough audio interfaces and got it for a good price. I definitely prefer the build quality of the VCI100 over the S4.

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Thanks for ongoing help Makar.

I agree on S4 build quality. I just can't be doing with the 'plastic-fantastic' kind of feel of the thing, hence it not being up for consideration. I'm glad to hear the Vestax machines are better built. I should clearly keep them in the picture and ideally check out a VCI-400.

Still love the 4Trak build and knob layout - it just looks like a controller I won't outgrow. Maybe I should just bite the bullet. If only a couple of people could give me some reassurance on portability ...

The 4TRAK is certainly a very nice Traktor controller but at over 7kgs it can hardly be called portable.

Do you regularly mix with 3 or 4 track decks? If not, there are many more portable options available if you're willing to downsize.

Primary use is going to be as a Traktor controller, but I want the option to run a 1210 through it, and ideally be able to plug an iPad/iPod in as backup, so functionality as a standalone mixer is important. Also like the balanced outs, needle drop controllers and the general layout of the console. Media browser controls and cueing/deck controls just make sense to me, and faders look large and robust.

Really have to order tomorrow, so I'm going to sleep on it and bite the bullet tomorrow morning. There are some weird deals floating around on the 4Trak - like they won't drop the price, but they'll throw in a shit-load of stuff you don't really need, like M-Audio studio monitors and a copy of Wobble. I guess they're not allowed to discount so they give away a load of freebies.

I'm probably leaning towards the MC-6000 as the sensible option, but I'm also going to look into the Vestax further and then probably write 3 names on a piece of paper, close my eyes and stick a pin in!

Thanks again.

Have you checked out the XDJ Aero from Pioneer at all? It's fully standalone(works with or without a computer), and also has line/phono inputs for your turntable and Ipod.

And as it's only a 2 deck controller it's much smaller and lighter than most of the 4 deck controllers mentioned so far.

but not scratch certified, neither the 4Track, so you'll also need Scratch A6/A10 package to be able to control the software with any timecode source.

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Originally Posted by Steve Zorilow

Modular for me in most gig. Discuss...

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Depends on the scale of the gig. If I'm doing a big set somewhere, or people are coming SPECIFICALLY to see me play, I want as much flexibility as possible, so I'll go modular. If I'm doing a smaller venue, or just playing a club where people care more about getting wankered than the music, I'll take my all-in-one.

XDJ Aero looks cool, but it strikes me as a bit of a jack-of-all-trades and perhaps loses out on the Traktor integration front as a result. It's also all plastic, which I think reduces it's suitability for gigging. The idea of DJ'ing wirelessly also scares the pants off me - if I want to connect a device to my controller, I'd lilke to see a cable that I can clumsily detach and reconnect, rather than having to troubleshoot IP addresses or network settings. Cool piece of kit though.

Scratch certification is not such a big deal for me. I'm not using timecode CDs or vinyl at the moment, and don't mind stumping up for an extra interface if I need to move in that direction, which I think is necessary for pretty much all none-NI interfaces.

I have a 4Trak and I've lugged it to gigs. The Numark backpack looks like the optimal solution, I should get me one of those...

Between the Denon and the Numark, remember that 4Trak has custom integration into Traktor for the jogs, comparable to the S4. AFAIK the Denon has to rely on basic MIDI jog functionality, which has always been pretty laggy and imprecise in Traktor. Personally I would prefer Denon style soft buttons to the clicky Numark buttons, but it's a tradeoff I can live with. Another thing is that the Denon has mini sized pitch faders, and that's a definite no-no for me.

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Originally Posted by DJQA

I have a 4Trak and I've lugged it to gigs. The Numark backpack looks like the optimal solution, I should get me one of those...

Between the Denon and the Numark, remember that 4Trak has custom integration into Traktor for the jogs, comparable to the S4. AFAIK the Denon has to rely on basic MIDI jog functionality, which has always been pretty laggy and imprecise in Traktor. Personally I would prefer Denon style soft buttons to the clicky Numark buttons, but it's a tradeoff I can live with. Another thing is that the Denon has mini sized pitch faders, and that's a definite no-no for me.

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Completely agree with this. You get the backpack and you're golden. It's big yes, but the build and size are worth it when you get in front on the gear. The pitch faders and jog wheels are perfect if you're used to djing on standard Pioneer CDJ's, like the majority of clubs use.

I got the 4Trak instead of the S4 for a number of reasons; build quality, size, jog wheels and pitch faders. And it's the only controller I can think of, barring the Pioneer DDJ T1, that is 1:1 integrated with Traktor.

Totally agree with everyhting above. 4Trak is very close to my dream controller ...

Unfortuantely the size/portability thing is a bit of a deal-breaker. It ocurred to me today that when I go down to London for gigs, I often have other meetings, and realistically lugging around the 4Trak from place to place isn't going to work. Just going to the gig and back again would have been fine (in fact I had it in my basket first thing this morning), but I'm going to need somehting slightly more portable.

So, I've ordered the MC-6000 and the appropirate UDG bag, and I'm just going to have to live with the fact I've had to compromise slightly on the controller for the sake of portability. Maybe I could have made the 4Trak work, but on balance I had to go with my head for once.

I'll covet the 4Trak, but hopefully also enjoy the Denon.

Thanks to all for the help, feedback, guidance etc.

Jules

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Originally Posted by Trailerman

Totally agree with everyhting above. 4Trak is very close to my dream controller ...

Unfortuantely the size/portability thing is a bit of a deal-breaker. It ocurred to me today that when I go down to London for gigs, I often have other meetings, and realistically lugging around the 4Trak from place to place isn't going to work. Just going to the gig and back again would have been fine (in fact I had it in my basket first thing this morning), but I'm going to need somehting slightly more portable.

So, I've ordered the MC-6000 and the appropirate UDG bag, and I'm just going to have to live with the fact I've had to compromise slightly on the controller for the sake of portability. Maybe I could have made the 4Trak work, but on balance I had to go with my head for once.

I'll covet the 4Trak, but hopefully also enjoy the Denon.

Thanks to all for the help, feedback, guidance etc.

Jules

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If the 4Trak is too big but your ideal controller then you should be going for the S4. In my opinion.

I think the S4 was ruled out long ago due to poor build quality and no standalone mixer functionality.

Trailer an I went through a similar dilemma to you recently and went for the MC6000 due to its build and input options. I don't think you will be dissapointed. It's a great solution to take to a bar, plug in the existing TT's and have digital options alongside a vinyl bag.

Hey guys,


I have a HUGE problem. I bought a 4TRAK a few months ago and quite happy with it, but now I want to take it with me on gigs on the road with a decent and protective backpack. Obviously my eye fell on the Numark Controller Backpack first, because it has the exact dimensions of the piece of gear. I live in Europe and trangely enough, the backpack is sold out EVERYWHERE. I called almost every store in Europe to see if they got one left. I even mailed Numark but their poor customer support didn't even answer. Now I'm looking for a decent, protective & obviously fitting bag, but big players like UDG don't even have one. U guys have any suggestions on which bag to buy? I encountered the DJC-SC5 from Pioneer on my search, but don't know if it will fit due to the seperate FX-unit that the 4TRAK offers.

Plz guys I'm desperate :'(