Eskmo, big gigantic and opiuo are three of my faves all use controllers and all of perform very live as well as savoy
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Eskmo, big gigantic and opiuo are three of my faves all use controllers and all of perform very live as well as savoy
There was a time I was really into industrial, stuff like Birmingham 6, Zero Defects, and X Marks the Pedwalk on the industrial end and Faith & the Muse, Switchblade Symphony, and Dead Can Dance on the gothy end. And I've always been a huge fan of Zombie, PM5K, and any of the more industrial inspired rock (NIN, Ministry, yadda yadda).Quote:
I don't look goth/industrial, but I love the music and the scene. It's just not my style.
I agree with this to an extent, but I also know that isn't the only way someone can begin to use controllers. Plenty of people have embraced them because of their convenience.Quote:
I think the "issue" is that there aren't really that many people who've clawed up to top-end artist status in the dance scene since controllers became popular.
I don't think the point of controllers is to offer a novel experience. In the cases where they're used to any good effect, they're simply the right tool for the job.Quote:
...it's still just the same kinds of things people did 30 years ago with sequencers, synths, & drum machines during the rave days.
I disagree with this completely. When it was released in the early 90's, the NewTek Video Toaster totally changed the business of Video Production, in terms of both quality and ease of use. That product changed EVERYTHING. The same thing applies to the advent of ProTools (around the same time, actually). All these products really did was move the production workflow from analog to digital, but I think you'd agree that simple shift changed everything. And this is where we are right now in the DJ industry.Quote:
The problem–as I see it–is that these controllers, mostly, just make live sets like that cheaper. They haven't added that much in terms of what you can make, and they haven't really changed how you do it. They haven't even really made it easier, as there always were ways to keep notes in key/scale...
Also, you can't use the price reduction as a pejorative. It's an incredibly important part of this change we're in the middle of. People who would never have been able to explore their creative side are now able to produce incredibly sophisticated content, and then distribute that content worldwide. This is the same kind of innovation that enabled people like Juan Atkins and Derrick May to invent new genres of music - only now that hardware is even more powerful.
Frankly, in the context of my original question, I don't give a shit if someone considers it "DJing" or not. I quit caring about the purity of the "art" a long time ago. If you'll notice, I took some care to not mention DJing specifically in my post at all. But your comment here does point to the intent of my post. I served up a softball because I wanted to see if people would swing at it, and how. It's easy for me to get access to sales figures for hardware. But what I can't do without help is tap into the collective consciousness and figure out what people think about controllers. Have we reached a point where users no longer feel they have to defend or legitimize their use? It seems that we still have a way to go - even in communities that were created specifically to champion their use.Quote:
It's not DJing anymore if you're doing anything more interesting than what Skrillex did.
I'll use Deadmau5 as an example because it's easy. When I talk to one of his fans and ask about him using a computer in a slightly derogatory way, they usually immediately say something to the effect of "yeah, but he has a ton of hardware synths now as well". You would never see a professional audio engineer say "Yeah, but I also have a razor blade and edit tape right here", because that industry has moved past the point where anyone feels the need to apologize for the use of a DAW.
And this illustrates my point perfectly. In fact, they HAVE taken off. There is a whole generation of Live users that are performing in front of crowds using computers and controllers. It isn't that controllers aren't being used - they most definitely are. But performers that use them EXCLUSIVELY still seem to be looked down on.Quote:
I think that's why they haven't taken off, at least the performances you're talking about.
The "anti-controller" movement is perpetuated by people who feel the need to defend controllers. I've stopped defending my S4, APC20 & Traktor setup. If somebody walks up to my booth just to knock my gear, I smile, shrug, and tell them to find some new material. I can rattle off every point they've drilled into memory from the Serato forums anyway.
I'm not bothered by the fact that Rob Swire uses a Midi guitar, nor should anybody else be. He's obviously a talented, accomplished guitar player who saw a benefit to using a Ztar, and not simply because it's "cool". It opened up a new range of possibilities and maybe a touch of added convenience (no tuning or strings to replace). But I can tell you one thing, it's not because he wanted to save a few dollars or take the easy way out.
Nem, those are very good points.
I really think it depends on the world. The dance music world seems to be more resistant than others (e.g., VNV, etc.), which confuses me.
For the record, there are still people who think that tape is superior (not just as an effect, but actually recording to and finishing on tape), that MPCs kill musicians, that sampling is the same as playing a record, and that open tunings on a guitar are a sin (unless you're playing slide for some reason).
I would definitely be interested if you can figure out why DJing seems to be lagging behind.
Personally I think it's all gone downhill since they put black keys on the piano.... ;)
To respond to the original question, I saw Magda rock it with just two X1s not that long ago. Nobody in the house seemed to care that she wasn't using "real" DJ equipment. No idea if that's her regular setup.
But since you're not just interested in "DJs'" look into folks like Evolution Control Committee, who performs using a novel interactive video controller that he designed with a couple old Wii machines and a projector. And of course Moldover who also designs his own gear as someone else mentioned. Guess these folks don't qualify as top tier but whatever; they scrape out a living doing whatever it is you call what they're doing, and people seem to have heard of them.
Controllers are a game-changer in my mind. The future is bright, and controllers are lighting the way.
From my viewpoint the upper end shouldn't be considered in how many controllers are digital DJs using in live performance but in the way how are they using controllers to improve and define their style and techniques. Most of people don't push their controller's potential to max because they don't dig enough into mappings which can be a game changers for most of them in my opinion.
I'm talking about advanced mappings that can turn any MIDI controller into awesome controllerist tool.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RTiDQqIytKk