Help needed: W&W sounding drop sidechain settings?

[Polygon]

Hey, i'm currently working on an original track and i've basically got the intro, outro, first pre-drop melody and second pre-drop melodies already done and mixed down, and i've just started with the drop.
I already have the rhythmic part of it, drums are done, but it just lacks the low-end crunchiness you can hear in tracks like this:




or this




Or even Garrixes Animals.


So i said "i'll do it, it shouldn't be that hard.

Turns out it's about 3 days i'm in a complete stall regarding the drop, sidechain techniques i've used in the past don't seem to work as the bass hits at the same time as the kick, and it falls off after it, which is unusual compared to what i'm used to do (duck the bass under the kick and let it rise after).
If i don't sidechain, i completely lose the punch of the kick and it ends up sounding like a retarded slowed-down hardstyle track, while if i do sidechain, i lose all of the bass during the kick and the first quarter-to-half of the beat just sounds dull and lifeless.

So, any help? Anything? :P

Thanks!

-l

[Polygon]

BAHMP plx

[ImNotDedYet]

You should probably post this in the Music Production forum. This is for music that has been produced, or mixes. Actual questions and answers go there.

As for an answer...you got me. I've never heard a bassline consisting of sixteenth or thirty-second notes only, and that would only play during the kick. I'm assuming you've played with all of your sidechain compressor's settings, specifically the knee, attack and release?

[Polygon]

You should probably post this in the Music Production forum. This is for music that has been produced, or mixes. Actual questions and answers go there.

As for an answer...you got me. I've never heard a bassline consisting of sixteenth or thirty-second notes only, and that would only play during the kick. I'm assuming you've played with all of your sidechain compressor's settings, specifically the knee, attack and release?

Fuck. I somehow completely missed the music production section. Thanks for the heads up.

As for the second part of your answer, i'm not entirely sure if you're being highly helpful or highly sarcastic.
And if it is helpful, well yeah i've pretty much tried everything in my knowledge.

[Polygon]

MODS, could you please move this thread, or close it and i'll repost in production?

[Jester]

Done. don't sweat it

[PjAndreasson]

I may not be right, but try to increase the attack and a little bit on the ratio (about 3:5) on the compressor to give it a quick duck on the kick. This will make the synth play like usuall and still gives the kick headroom. I haven't tested this yet, but this is just what comes up to my mind. And btw, give it a bit alot of stereo enhancement, as this will actually save you headroom for the kick.

[AllDay]

The general consensus for compression is to have it at about 2.00 ms attack and 40.0ms release with a low setting around 1 or 2 would be best for your situation. It sounds as if your release time on your sidechain is huge!

[Negatron]

Hmm if you posted your track that would help. But Generally i think its a few things.

1. Your kick and Bass are fighting. Meaning you have a subby kick and subby bass.Perhaps try a punchier kick and roll of some lows. or vice versa

2. A trick i picked up somewhere a long time ago is regarding your actual side chain technique. MOST people just sidechain their bass off of their main kick. This will hurt your mix in alot of ways. What you want to do is create another kick track. Title it "false kick" turn the output so it has none. Leave it at 0.0. Copy your kick to this track. Then edit the kick on the false track so that is shorter than your actual kick. Because what you want is your sidechain to be on the "and" beat not the "uh" beat. Having the sub part of your bass trigger the sidechain will result in a slower pumping action and make your track feel slow. So drag or cut the tail of the kick so the sub is not there. This will result in a snappier pumping action. I sometime drag it further to taste depending on the urgency of the track. This will allow for a more audible bass even if they are fighting.

3. Are you going for a trendy hardstyle kick? If so then you dont need a bass most likely. That should be all of your low end unless you layer a sub bass on top. But that tends to be what a hardstlyle kick anyways. In "the code" They just have that hardstlye kick with a very distorted lead thats spread very wide across a stereo image.

/end rant
/i miss this forum

[Polygon]

I may not be right, but try to increase the attack and a little bit on the ratio (about 3:5) on the compressor to give it a quick duck on the kick. This will make the synth play like usuall and still gives the kick headroom. I haven't tested this yet, but this is just what comes up to my mind. And btw, give it a bit alot of stereo enhancement, as this will actually save you headroom for the kick.

I played with the ratios a lot, and i'd prefer not to put stereo enhancers on the bass because of how bad it would translate on sub-equipped systems..