Has The Pirate Bay Ship Finally Sunk.

[Monika.mhz]

The way I see it is as follows:

The Pirate bay provide a NETWORK where some piracy happens. If the pirate bay is guilty, so is your ISP, and the Backbones. And ANYONE who provides a network that they knowingly are aware that illegal activity happens on. The state is guilty of facilitating speeding, so are the auto makers, etc. The radio!! Those bastards with their tape recorders are recording music FREE from the radio and the stations KNOW this!!

The pirate bay is NO more guilty of piracy, than your ISP is.

Do I think that the people who are stealing the music should stop? sure. will they? nope. Just like people won't stop speeding or TiVo-ing shows, or recording radio.

The solution is "accessibility" When VCRs came out the MPAA and television said it would be the END of the industry! But then DVDs came out! and they were far more accessible then spending hours programming your VCR. People were downloading TV shoes and TiVO and then on demand television and internet TV came out and the industry is flourishing again.

The industry is terrible at keeping up with the times and accessibility. If you can make the new market MORE accessible than the illegal activity, the majority of people WILL participate in the legal activity.

Trent Reznor's Digg Dialogg was very interesting on this subject.
http://digg.com/dialogg/Trent_Reznor

[JesC]

[midian]

The old industry model is terribly terribly flawed. For the most part they are still trying to push CDs which are outdated and massively overpriced. Even now with the gradual acceptance of digital downloads they are still providing a substandard service and product. Those who do provide a good service/product (Beatport etc) charge quite a lot for it, but at least in those cases the artist gets a large proportion of the money, so you can see models already in mass acceptance doing very well and being used.

One of the other things about digital music which I dont feel is being accounted for is hat people have an UNLIMITED appetite for music. You dont stop buying cos theres nthing else you want, you stop buying cos you have no more money to spend on it. If it was cheap enough it would be FAR FAR FAR more likely to entice people to buy that extra tune or album, and get people more addicted to it.

These new models and internet file sharing as well is being persecuted because the old industry has NO IDEA how to control it or use it properly to make money so they just sue the fuck out of it instead using scare tactics and power to try and stop people doing it, but it wont work. Other companies and models who do know how are taking over and giving more rights & profits to the artists (OH NOES!) as well as providing a better, cheaper service.

Some people will always pirate, but most people wont. Some people will do a bit of both, but people are always willing to pay if its good, easy and not overpriced.

/end rant

[midifidler]

I stopped pirating 100% of my music when I was offered a better alternative in the form of beat port itunes etc.

Before that if I wanted to buy anything that was not mainstream I would be looking at paying about 40 NZD (about a full days wage at that point in life) and having to wait several weeks, and this was after having to find a store that could actually import it for me.

So I resorted to having to spend hours trolling for the right download, and it often turning out to be crap quality.

Now for 2$ I can buy virtually any tune I want and get it in a couple of minutes, in very good quality.

So now If I can buy it I will, and If I pirated it before and still listen to it Ill buy it again.

Unfortunately for the record industry while they where busy trying to kill this inter tube thing Apple came along and convinced them to let them sell tracks legally on a online store. They failed to see the potential and because of that they let a company who's only interest was to sell more MP3 players set the pricing standard for online distribution.

Piracy is here to stay and the only way to find a sustainable solution is to offer a better service for those who can actually afford to take the moral high ground.

Sure you can fight it legally by trying to close down organizations who offer a level of service comparable to legal online stores. They are the big players and taking them down is a financially effective way of reducing piracy, chasing the individuals either in the heinous way the RIAA does, or through new legislation is not.

[emp]

The way I see it is as follows:

The Pirate bay provide a NETWORK where some piracy happens. If the pirate bay is guilty, so is your ISP, and the Backbones. And ANYONE who provides a network that they knowingly are aware that illegal activity happens on. The state is guilty of facilitating speeding, so are the auto makers, etc. The radio!! Those bastards with their tape recorders are recording music FREE from the radio and the stations KNOW this!!

The pirate bay is NO more guilty of piracy, than your ISP is.

Do I think that the people who are stealing the music should stop? sure. will they? nope. Just like people won't stop speeding or TiVo-ing shows, or recording radio.

The solution is "accessibility" When VCRs came out the MPAA and television said it would be the END of the industry! But then DVDs came out! and they were far more accessible then spending hours programming your VCR. People were downloading TV shoes and TiVO and then on demand television and internet TV came out and the industry is flourishing again.

The industry is terrible at keeping up with the times and accessibility. If you can make the new market MORE accessible than the illegal activity, the majority of people WILL participate in the legal activity.

Trent Reznor's Digg Dialogg was very interesting on this subject.
http://digg.com/dialogg/Trent_Reznor

Gonna let RSDJMoniker speak for me from now on

Was gonna post link to NiN but she beat me to it... jarr

[emp]

Fredrik Söderling: The Pirate Bay sentence is surprisingly harsh
http://www.dn.se/kultur-noje/musik/f...harsh-1.846920


The Pirate Bay sentenced to one year in prison
http://www.dn.se/kultur-noje/musik/t...rison-1.846915

[selfinfliction]

"it is theft by any other name"

Thats the quote from the industry.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/8003799.stm

I know this will spark debate. But i see it like this.

I go up to someone i dont know and i say "the people who live next to me keep a key under the mat. Its up to you if you rob them"

All this shit about "we dont host the stuff" is crap.
The people who sell guns dont kill people, the people who buy the guns kill people. Rubbish.
All bollocks in my opinion.
All aiding crime.

And NO this isnt about Free Speech or Freedom Of Information. Its about theft.

*runs aways from lynch mob*

if that was the case, then it should be the pencil maker's fault when a student writes the wrong answers on a test.

[Karlos Santos]

if that was the case, then it should be the pencil maker's fault when a student writes the wrong answers on a test.

Thats stupid and you know it.
God ive heard some crap but thats just pityful. Surely you can come up with something better than that.

The drug dealer is a criminal just like the drug taker.
The thief is a criminal just like the person who buys stolen goods.

The pencil maker isnt stupid just because the student is remedial.

That makes no sense what-so-ever.

You may have well of said "My cars banana thong has green wardrobe sheep on the Obama" it makes about the same amount of sense.

[Monika.mhz]

This thread is bordering on being closed/deleted.

guys, keep it civil and constructive. Or the mod-hammer will fall!

[nicolas]

Take a look at the "Legal Threats" in the home page of PB (I won't post the link).
No matter how hard the industry tries, there will always be a response, piracy still spins around a guilty/not gulty subject, the violation of the law, laws that are written thanks to the money of lobbysts and not exactly for the wellness of people around music (industry is just that word I don't wanna use). Not even producers, artists, dj's or singers have an equal opinion about it; law as it is, it's just a set of words anyone can manipulate according to their needs.
As much as many of them fight against it' I don't really see them going down, living on the streets or whatever people is doing right now around the world. Of course artists should be retributed fot what they do, they deserve it, they have worked really hard, and you always want to do something you really love and live happy for doing it. You just would not let an artist you really like losing everything. New ways of retribution will and they have appeared before.
But on the other side some of this websites have allowed people to get resources that before would have been imposible (how many digital movie makers bought an original software at once?) , and it also helped much of the underground movements get in touch with more people. They make the internet much richer, even if it is thru the constant race with the business. The only danger is that we all start to sound the same, but that's up to us, music is never going to end (the industry might).