torrents keeping music alive (sensible descusssion please) - Page 5
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  1. #41
    Tech Guru MiL0's Avatar
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    I personally think artists/labels are simply going to have to get used to earning a lot less money than they were in the 80's to 90's. A lot of labels/artists act like it's the norm to be earning thousands of dollars per month from their music but this kind of money is a relatively new thing, in the grand scheme of things.

    Don't get me wrong; I was invovled in the dnb scene a few years back so I know how much work goes into writing music and touring. But did I ever expect to earn £1000+ per hour for playing a few records? No! If I do a 9-5 in the studio, 5 days a week, why do I deserve to be earning more than, say, a doctor earns?

    The music industry in the 80's and 90's was nuts... way too much money being made and everyone got greedy. Now that we have an illegal and easily accessible alternative (torrents), the public has chosen with their wallets... they don't believe that the music is worth what the labels were charging a few years back.

    Now, companies like Spotify and Netflix have got it right. Charge an annual flat fee for as much music/films as you like. Both these services have significantly cut down my torrenting activities. Yes, it's true that the artists/labels/studios don't earn as much but then did they ever really deserve to be earning as much as before? Besides, the cheaper Spotify/Netflix become, the more people sign up to them... a million people paying a $ per month is still better than 10 people paying $10 per month.

    And that's not even mentioning the fact that it's pretty hard to pirate a live performance. Artists need to accept that music production is simply a form of marketing. Get your music out there and make a living from performing it live. I know I made a LOT more money from dj'ing than I ever made from releasing the few records I had out.

  2. #42
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    Milo where did you find they are earning less money. the big companies are making more than ever. Artists are making more than ever, its easier and cheaper than ever to distribute music. all thats happened is they have not passed there saving onto the end users

  3. #43
    Tech Guru MiL0's Avatar
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    really? I'd be shocked if the major labels are making as much money as they were in the 80's-90's.

    I was spending around £20-50 per month on music back in the day... now I barely spend that in a year.

    A quick google reveals this:



    A good example is Subtitles music (a medium sized dnb label). They've recently announce that they're going digital only (as no one is buying their vinyl anymore). The problem with this is that the profit margins in digital are much smaller than vinyl. This is exacerbated by the fact that they're also not selling as many units as they were, say, 10 years ago.

    http://forum.breakbeat.co.uk/tm.aspx?m=1975263819

  4. #44
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    I use torrents occasionlly to preview albums and if its good i'll usually buy it. I dont use em for dj music as alot of the time i found the quality was unreliable, some labelled as 320 were often just converted up from lower bitrates.

    I think a big problem now is an artist has 1 successful single and the albums wheeled out within the next 2 weeks before anymore singles and you buy the album for £12 or so and find its a bag of shit with 1 or 2 decent tracks and the rest is nothing like the single. Instead of releasing 3 or 4 singles then the album so you have a better feeling of what the artist is like.

  5. #45
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    milo the world does not end at the borders of USA. Most the record companies are having year on year record profits. This is partly due to the increased westernisation of the world. Music sales in china have shot up, funnily enough along with the sale of apple products. youve even got a company in iraq replicating apple stores.

    The big loosers are record stores. HMV in the UK is struggling even though most its compertition has died. But they do stupid things such as there crappy online music store and stupidly high priced vinyl. ok a single used to be £4 and you got 3 or 4 tracks on that, so the shop makes around £2.50 off it. say 30p to make it another 30p to ship it. that leaves us with 90p for 3 or 4 tracks. we now pay 99p for 1 so the profits vs sales have increased by around 400% because of digital music

  6. #46
    Tech Guru MiL0's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tombruton69 View Post
    milo the world does not end at the borders of USA. Most the record companies are having year on year record profits. This is partly due to the increased westernisation of the world. Music sales in china have shot up, funnily enough along with the sale of apple products. youve even got a company in iraq replicating apple stores.

    The big loosers are record stores. HMV in the UK is struggling even though most its compertition has died. But they do stupid things such as there crappy online music store and stupidly high priced vinyl. ok a single used to be £4 and you got 3 or 4 tracks on that, so the shop makes around £2.50 off it. say 30p to make it another 30p to ship it. that leaves us with 90p for 3 or 4 tracks. we now pay 99p for 1 so the profits vs sales have increased by around 400% because of digital music
    that's really interesting... I've never heard of this before.

    Have you got any links to support this? I've always heard that digital unit sales have never matched the heyday of cd/vinyl unit sales from the 80's and 90's.

    edit: and it's funny to hear you mention China as being a place where music sales have shot up. Sales couldn't really have got any worse could they? (considering China's repuation for being poor on upholding copyright laws)

  7. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by Miec View Post

    I have yet to try out Spotify's offline mode in premium which could probably solve my issues but until I find the time to do that, I will keep my torrented music on my phone without feeling bad for it.
    Spotify offline mode works great!

    Quote Originally Posted by tombruton69 View Post
    Most the record companies are having year on year record profits.
    I'm not saying you're wrong, but I find that hard to believe. Do you have any sources to back that up?
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  8. #48
    Tech Guru MiL0's Avatar
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    Here we go:

    http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/2012...al-music-sales

    also the chart below shows total digital/traditional sales of albums vs singles. As you can see, the music industry has been in recession since the beginning of the century:



    Source: IFPI (1973-2008)

    Now you're arguing that there is more profit to be made from digital sales. This might be true, but how much of it is going to the labels/artists and how much is going to itunes and spotify?

  9. #49
    Tech Guru MiL0's Avatar
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    This is a pretty concrete example of the effect of torrents/illegal downloading of music:



    it's no coincidence that with the increase in internet speeds, came a massive drop in consumer spending on music/films.

  10. #50
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    its really hard to actually get real figures as most of these companies move money around to avoid paying taxes. but i wont go to much into it as I am very anti america (not the people but the ppl who run the goverment) china has got alot better for copywrite so has russia, quite interesting all there schools moved over to linux cuz they where told they had to buy windows licences, that made me chuckle.

    btw its not torrents that is destroying music its casset tapes. that is why there was huge lawsuits to get there sale banned,

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