How to do Led Mapping without LED Midi Data..

[fullenglishpint]

or the omni control, or the vci-100... lol.

Did you find an LED map for your total control or what?

[theory28]

i had someone elses map that i referred to

[The Bong Squad]

Surely it should be up to the manufacturers of controllers to work directly with Native Instruments to have LED outputs running off the same inputs as corresponding input channels? As mapping outputs should be an easy task, as it should be 100% functional for the user.

As we are their key target audience, and user functionality should be a key priority in controller design. Not every one likes the manufacturer controller mappings and the controller should be as easy to work with the user as possible, not only making user interaction better but maximizing impact when performing.

Yes, I can admit that in some existing controllers there are design flaws make that make this impossible to implement, but surely Native Instruments should still have the 'auto learn' feature available to those who can implement this on their controllers as mapping 8 x 64 (512) output's is not fun and very time consuming

[nem0nic]

Again, how do you "auto-learn" an output? How can software "auto-learn" something when data isn't being sent to it? Are you assuming that all hardware manufacturers use the same note sent as the feedback message? Even assuming that is true (which it often is), what about the last byte of the message? Does 00 trigger the action? Or maybe 7F? Maybe something in-between, where multiple states are possible (like solid, blinking, and multiple colors). If an out of range message is sent, does the light go on or off - or is the message ignored completely?

ALL of these issues come up when talking about MIDI feedback and building a MIDI spec for hardware.

So even if Native were to assume that the feedback for every note message was the same as the note it received and automatically generated a MIDI output message based on that assumption, you would STILL need to go and manually handle the controller range. And we're not even talking about deck assignment issues.

Would I like it if NI allowed the LEARN command to be available for an output message? Sure, that would be nice in some cases. But it wouldn't keep you from having to go in by hand and tweak.

[fullenglishpint]

@nemonic, exactly the same as the input commands... I don't see what you're objecting to.

@the bong squad, no need for anyone to work directly with NI. It would be kinda nice if notes for LEDs were always the same as the button notes and that's just standard midi protocol, nothing traktor specific. Unless someone can think of a problem with that that I'm missing. LED mapping remains my most hated part of midi mapping.

Moreover, if we're talking about what NI can do, I'd like to see an ableton style mapping system where everything mappable is highlighted in the GUI when you press a hotkey and you just click the control then move the corresponding part of the midi controller to auto learn it. This has to be backed up by the current system of course for tweaking, but it would make things much quicker. It's been requested before but there we go.

[The Bong Squad]

So even if Native were to assume that the feedback for every note message was the same as the note it received and automatically generated a MIDI output message based on that assumption, you would STILL need to go and manually handle the controller range. And we're not even talking about deck assignment issues.

Would I like it if NI allowed the LEARN command to be available for an output message? Sure, that would be nice in some cases. But it wouldn't keep you from having to go in by hand and tweak.

By assuming the output channel is exactly the same as the input channel / note.

Completely agree about the controller ranges, as its much better to understand when exactly an LED is going to turn on and how it will behave (blinking, colour etc).

Just a great shame that such a simple task can turn into a such a large amount of effort. I found that with my launchpad there was a system to the midi notes channel and all that needed to be done was draw up a diagram.

[theory28]

TL;DR

leds arnt sending data. so you cant auto map them

however, in an ideal world, the button and LED should have the same note.

but in reality, there should be an auto learn button that works like this:
mapp button
add an out
hit learn
hit button
LED light up to confirm
if the wrong LED lights, you can manually change the note, just like normal


*starts traktor 3 suggestion thread*

[nem0nic]

@nemonic, exactly the same as the input commands... I don't see what you're objecting to.

And I addressed that in my post. Not all LED feedback works that way. And even when it does, you still need to go back and define the last byte of the message by hand. So even if NI were to implement it the way you're outlining, the user would still need to go and tune the whole thing up manually.

So to sum it up, the reason why NI doesn't implement an "auto learn" function for MIDI feedback in Traktor is because it won't work with everything. If there was an agreed upon standard (like a SYSEX query) where a controller could report the proper format for MIDI feedback back to the application - THEN we'd have something. But even then, some manufacturers would screw it up. Device ID is a standard query and LOTS of manufacturers don't use it or don't use the standard messaging.

[Dj shabbar]

I am working ... on it trying to find new .. Way to know LED Notes data .. Sure will Post soon ... If i had a chance ... or lastly have to contact my Product manufacturer .. Thanks ... once again .. .

[Dj shabbar]

or the omni control, or the vci-100... lol.

Did you find an LED map for your total control or what?

Not yet ... workimg on try and Error ...Hope something i can get .. Here is the player image .. i am sending .. to you .. Thanks
http://www.nx-audio.com/images/cdj700s/CDJ700S.jpg