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  1. #11
    Tech Guru lethal_pizzle's Avatar
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    It's not the tool mate.

    It's just like saying you're a forensic scientist when in fact you're a general doctor. And then you meet an actual forensic scientist who tears you a new forensic asshole.

    I don't think of myself as a musician when I DJ. I just play songs musicians have made, for people's enjoyment.

    I'd probably describe a controllerist/turntablist as a musician. Although I'm not a big fan of that kind of music.
    Last edited by lethal_pizzle; 08-23-2010 at 09:17 AM.
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  2. #12
    Tech Guru Fyoog's Avatar
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    There's some good points about this in this one below:

    http://www.djtechtools.com/forum/sho...upboard&page=5
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  3. #13
    Tech Guru completej's Avatar
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    Though I've never done anything professionally, from the standpoint of any artist it appears your job is to attempt and illicit a response (emotional, physical, whatever) when producing your art.

    If you just play recorded songs for a person, then you're just a jukebox. But you're not, you're human, and you reach deep into your record bag for the right song, the right pitch, the right tempo, the right beat, and you craft together a string of songs to make people sweat it out on the dancefloor.

    That, my friend, is an artist, regardless of tool.
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  4. #14
    Tech Guru space monkey's Avatar
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    I'm a Button Jockey

  5. #15

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    Quote Originally Posted by completej View Post
    Or is it the tool that defines the artist?

    For what is the artist without his tools? but it is also the artists use of the tools which further strengthen his position.



    Some deep psychological shit going on.

    EDIT: I'm high. sorry
    Last edited by jdog667jkt; 08-23-2010 at 10:35 AM.
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  6. #16
    Tech Guru BradCee's Avatar
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    tbh i throw the word controllerist around when describing what i do, use it more as guideline to show that it's a bit more than regular djing. still refer to myself as a dj

    not sure if layering loops across 3 or 4 decks at a time with effects counts as this properly though, as it could be done with cdjs or even tts. but then it's not a dj set it's a 'dex n fx' set. again a term used to elevate just a bit above the conception of mixing track a to track b.

    if you feel you do more than a > b > a > b, then use a 'buzz' word when describing what you do, but don't define yourself with it.

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  7. #17
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    no. that'd be like saying just because a dj uses turntables that makes him a turntablist, when it really does not.

    unless you're doing complex tricks and routines with your controllers, you're just a regular dj. crafty use of fx and 3-4 deck mixing does not constitute as a controllerism routine either. that's just mixing other people's music, albeit slightly more advanced than simple traditional a-b mixing.

  8. #18
    Tech Guru lethal_pizzle's Avatar
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    Here are the wikipedia entries:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turntablism
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Controllerism

    ...I wouldn't be surprised if the controllerism one was written by one of the members here...
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  9. #19
    Mudo
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    ...

    Controllerism is "conceptualized" by Moldover to "separate" himself from turntablism because he uses some "techniques" but not turntables.

    Nowadays with DVS I could send Midi and OSC with my regular turntable and I am...

    turntablist approarching to controllerism?

    perhaps but I have integrated my arduinome (osc controller) and my vestax vci 100 to some "tricks" and then I am...

    controllerist approarching to turntablism?

    No. I'm still a Free Human Creative outside all these "mind jails".

    I use tooltablism to integrate any "tool" (turntable as a tool not only as a instrument) in my attempt to fill the gap and build a bridge between all this "organized desesperation".

    I can't imagine Michelangelo asking himself... Am I a sculptor or painter? What is best for expressing myself?

    More about Sifu Lee philosophy and Artform:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Iy3EJ5QTrx4


    enjoy...
    ...

  10. #20
    Tech Guru BradCee's Avatar
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    no. that'd be like saying just because a dj uses turntables that makes him a turntablist, when it really does not.
    well, no, it isn't. if someone called themselves a turntablist then just a/b mixed with no scratching or other tricks they'd be called out straight away.

    also with my example i used the qualifier 'not sure if' but i do have a few cue/loop juggle routines which i pull out, question then becomes what amount of the time has to be taken up by these to qualify, obviously 1 doesn't, but you can't do it all night either.

    also is controllerism defined purely by cue juggle routines? or does it encompass the live remix/mash-up side to(re; wiki link)? as the majority of stuff i tend to do leans that way.

    the wiki link is a touch broad in it's definition, i think the key thing to remember is; like turntablism, there are people with varying levels of skill/creativity and some push boundaries more than others, while i wouldn't consider myself to be anywhere near the level of ean or moldover. i do consider what i do personally to be a bit further on from the traditional sense of things with turntables/cdjs - a comparison i base on my former experience with tts and cdjs over the last 10 or so years.

    at the end of the day, imo, if you're rocking a controller and doing more than a/b/a/b/a/b/a/b/a/b/... it counts. yes some of it can be done with tt/cdj set-ups (again i speak from experience) but you can push things on that bit more.
    at my tt peak i could drop 20-25 tracks in an hour and beatmatch on fly, and that track/min average is still something i maintain now, but i can give things more of a 'twist' than i used to. but i didn't consider that turntablism, and if it it's just a/b/a... in traktor it's not controllerism either - just very quick djing

    i think my closest 'non-contoller' comparison would be my old 2x cdj and 2x efx500 setup, with some complex splitter arrangement on the audio cables so channels a & d were the cdjs, and b & c were the efx units - did a lot 'echo feedback' to sample/re-sample and mess things about.
    while it had the same kind of effect as what i now do, i wouldn't have tried to call it controllerism, as controllers weren't involved. instead i leant more towards the 'dex n fx' pigeon hole (first saw the drumattic twins use this label), which i can't use now, even though the workflow is similar, as no decks are involved and it would be the first thing people would flag.
    wouldn't have considered turntablism as i can't scratch, though i use the zabiela transform effect trick, but if we're honest that can't be considered true scratching. (i know i argued opposite in another thread but that was for poopz and lolz)

    maybe some of it is me being up my own arse a bit about what i do (if so i hold my hands up to that), but i honestly think if you are doing something that make you stand out then shout about it and slap a fancy word on it. if you get handed 2 mixes that are both called labeled as a 'dj mix' you'll most likely pick which one you listen to first based on track list. but if one was described it in a way that makes it sound more interesting, you're more likely to listen to that first - just make sure you're confident in being able to back up your claims.

    to sum up my thoughts on all aspects of dj/mixing styles;
    dj - a/b mixes, maybe some effects between transitions, uses tt, cdj or software
    turntablist - scratches, does mental routines using double ups and other tricks, works mainly on tt, possibly with dvs can be done on cdj. can use controllers
    dex n fx - done with more than 2 tts or cdjs (any combination) uses samplers or sampler style effects, remixes and mashes up live. could also encompass dvs/controller hybrid set-ups, but has a different workflow/sound to turntablism.
    controllerism - combination of turntablism, dex n fx and cue juggles in any ratio/combination done on controllers, if tt/cdj timecode is involved then it's either turntablism or dex n fx dependent on workflow

    maybe some of that is too black and white, but as a guideline i think it works to illustrate my opinion.

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