Mix timing?
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Thread: Mix timing?

  1. #1
    Tech Convert
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    Default Mix timing?

    My mixes are are in sync and flow well together? But sometimes my timing seems to be a little off? Anybody have any tips?

  2. #2
    Tech Guru astromech's Avatar
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    In what way? Do you mean your phrasing is off by a bar our two?
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  3. #3
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    Are you phrase matching?

  4. #4
    Tech Guru exokinetic's Avatar
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    Good questions for clarification from the last two posters...


    But I think I can assume you mean that most of the time, when you have a track playing, you wait for a downbeat in that track(the begining of a new phrase or measure) to drop the first beat and/or noise in the next track.

    Now this would work 100% of the time if every single producer used the absolute first noise in their track as the actual start of the first measure of the track.

    In reality this just isn't the case.

    A very simple way to check any track is thus:

    Firstly, make sure that in Traktor preferences, under the "Deck Details" tab, and then under the "Deck Heading" section, make sure somewhere in your deck heading you have "Beats" represented.

    This is going to use the 1st grid marker that Traktor sets manually when you analyze a track (or wherever you put it if you do it manually - more on this later) and then its going to begin counting.


    It counts based on the setting you have set in your preferences, "Transport" Tab, "Beat Counter" section.

    I see a couple different recommendations for here.

    For the best compatibility across all genre types I use "4" Bars Per Phrase.

    A bar is represented as four beats. Traktor gives you a 3 digit integer counter with two decimals to separate the numbers and counts thus:

    1.1.1 1.2.1 1.3.1 1.4.1 2.1.1
    1.1.2 1.2.2 1.3.2 1.4.2 2.1.2
    1.1.3 1.2.3 1.3.3 1.4.3 2.1.3
    1.1.4 1.2.4 1.3.4 1.4.4 2.1.4
    > > > > > And so on, and so on.


    SO. All that being said, once you have beats enabled you do THIS to your track.


    Find exact beat of the first climax point in your track (usually the first main drop, after the initial buildup, and then bass cut... so where the bass returns)

    However you accomplish it cue you track to that first drop point, with the playback marker in Traktor's deck exactly on that very beginning of that drop beat. Now, using the advanced controls tab on your deck, under the "grid" layer, use the little trashcan button to delete traktors beat-grid. Now use the little antennae looking icon right next to the trashcan to set the "first" beat-grid marker in your track on that drop beat.



    OKAY.


    Now cue that track back to the VERY beginning. Cue to the FIRST noise of any kind on the track - Now - Look at the "Beats" readout on the deck that track is in. Does it read -X.1.1?

    If it does you are stoked. Delete the beat-grid marker you made at the drop point, and now set your FIRST beat-grid marker at the FIRST noise on the track, as you have now calculated that is the FIRST downbeat of the track.


    What if its not -X.1.1? Very simple. Start moving the grid manually until you find the FIRST grid marker that represent the count from -X.1.1 to X.4.4.

    THIS exact beat-grid marker is your tracks FIRST downbeat. Trash the beat-grid you set on the drop by just clicking the trash icon, so you don't loose the position of this downbeat. Then click the little antennae icon once more to set Traktors first grid marker on the bear you just calculated as the absolute first downbeat.


    If you do this to all your tracks, as long as you cue your 1st grid marker (it works just like a cue point, and takes up the cue1 position, so if you have a midi controller to launch cues, you can use this for your mix in cue! ) to the downbeat of the track your mixing into, you will always be in phrase.

    It sounds like you've got being in beat down.


    So beyond those two things, two track are not going to play nice together on any two downbeats layered.


    If your going to be really layering things deeply you can put your mouse point in the "strip" waveform view. When you do so, traktor puts a little number next to the mouse pointer. What its doing is telling you exactly how many bars of playback your mouse cursor currently is ahead of the current playback position of the track.


    SO.


    Take the track you are cueing up. Put the mouse into the stripe and see how many bars it is from the first downbeat until the first drop (you can usually see this in the waveform)....

    .. alternately you can do this calculation for all your tracks and put the number in the comments bar!...


    .... Now that you know exactly how many bars until the drop in this track, take a 4, 8, or 16 beat loop of your track you are going to bring in, with the beginning of the loop being your tracks FIRST downbeat. With the loop active, cue the downbeat into any downbeat of the track you are mixing into.


    NOW. Leave your mouse cursor in the stripe waveform of the track you are mixing INTO, right over its last drop (or alternatively, wherever you want the main drop in the track you are mixing in to line up with) Traktor is now going to tell you exactly how many bars until playback is going to reach that point.


    The track your mixing in is already playing, in beat, in phrase, and loops so that it is cueing its own downbeat every time it re-loops (WIN!!!)


    So all you do is start blending that track in, as you pay attention to the number of bars traktor is telling you until playback reaches the spot you want things to line up. When the Traktors number in the Stripe view matches the number of bars to the point in the track you are now mixing in, simply release the loop, and have fun being able to concentrate for the next few minutes on BLENDING the track, while you can be supremely confident that the most EPIC double drop is guaranteed to happen!





    Hope you read all this and that it helped!

  5. #5
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    WOW man thanks alot! Really appriciate that!

  6. #6
    Tech Guru deevey's Avatar
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    I got lost somewhere exokinetic

    I find there's a really nifty method of phrasing correctly regardless of the track...

    "Beatjump" has become a dirty little toy of mine .. find point in the track where the bass riff kicks in.

    jump back 32 > back 32 > back 32 > back 32 (far as you want)

    Cue, n' mix from that point.

    As mentioned not every track has exact phrasing (most do) ... Wrong Guru by Adam K for example has 2 additonal beats before the 4/4...if you try mixing from there everything sounds way off once the bassline kicks in.. using the method above and you'll land the mix without even hearing the track ever before.

  7. #7
    Tech Guru josh@firestorm's Avatar
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    knowing your tracks inside and out is essential for getting your mix phrasing right.

  8. #8
    Tech Guru deevey's Avatar
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    For some reason its only since the advent of digital that i've been noticing more and more "odd" beat phrasing of track intro's...And even weirder mastering.

    When I was playing vinyl tracks almost always had the beats dead on and could land the kicks dead on no-matter how mangled...better QC ?

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