The reason WHY A&H sounds warmer than Pioneer

[mostapha]

Unless Behringer got even dumber, audio doesn't go through the faders.

Exokinetic, I don't disagree with you. But, i'm probably going to end up with a Vestax instead...after i end up getting rid of my 62 (it's a great mixer but not what i want at the moment).

[exokinetic]

Totally, and I'm not dead set on anything yet, what particular models you looking at from Vestax?

[mostapha]

I've just been a huge fan of the 004xl since it came out…simple, no non-sense, everything I actually need…fine sound quality compared to basically everything I've heard.

I'm seriously considering doing a rotary conversion on one before Vestax has a chance to discontinue them…and probably sell my xone when I'm done. The 62 is obviously a fine mixer, but I just don't feel like it's right for me because of some of the ergo choices they made.

[V-Hoff]

Thank you for this awesome information

I've never really thinked about it...
It makes me think about keep with my internal mixing again...
I hate the fact to use different EQ configs on every club that I go...


What do you think to make this a DJTT Article ?
I really think you should do it!

[jayo]

great article for the homepage. And one where people will stop bitching about it being traktor specific, or a sales pitch by the DJTT team. +1

[djproben]

There was an article a year or two ago about internal vs. external mixing that covered a little of this ground. The article concluded that internal mixing could be better at least in terms of possibilities and flexibility but the problem is that we still don't have software that takes advantage of such possibilities. Traktor gives you a few EQ options but they are poorly implemented and even more poorly documented. None of them feature full kill EQs. This doesn't seem to be changing in Traktor 2. And I think Traktor is better off than any other DJ software in this manner. What would be really great is much more flexible control over EQs, and perhaps even a 7 or 8 band EQ with crossfader options like the Pioneer DJM 2000 offers. Shouldn't be terribly hard to implement in software but it doesn't seem like a priority for programmers working on such things at this time.

On another note, thanks to this thread I went looking for and found a used DDM4k for a really good price. I've been playing around with this feature a bit and the increments you can change the EQ settings in are awkward -- you really can't get to exactly 1200Hz for example. Not that it makes much difference but I'm wondering if I'm missing something on the adjustments? Overall this is a fun mixer to play with; it's just too bad the buttons and knobs feel so cheap and the effects are pretty lame. And to add insult to injury, Behringer designed their pots 180 degrees opposite every other pot I've seen, which means you can't just replace the knobs with nicer ones. Damn I still want a DB4....

I suppose if the Behringer grows on me though I might stick an innofader in it....

[mostapha]

Actually, proben, Ableton can do everything you mentioned if you're clever enough with mapping.

I was seriously considering using my VCM-600 and Ableton just as a mixer when I switched to Traktor and going the controller route…even had a decent als built up. In the end, I decided it wasn't worth it…IMHO, EQs are an effect like any other and putting that much of a focus on them makes it really easy to ruin an otherwise good set.

When I started–and for years afterwards–I wanted tunable full-kill EQs. Now…I still kinda like a deep-cut hi-mid from a xone because it emphasizes and removes snares so well and so many producers of tech house, techno, and progressive have been using snares to swing a groove, but I don't really use the others very much at all.

If you really give a damn, you can still find Electrix EQ Killers and Presonus EQ3B boxes, which can be used with whatever mixer you want so long as you're not mixing internally in Traktor. I'm pretty sure Alpha Recording and Electronique Spectacle make even higher-end units…and I know Rane makes some great parametric EQs that could be added to a DJ setup.

And if you are mixing in the box with a controller, a cheap version of Ableton Live should still come with EQ8. There are even presets floating around for EQ8 that more-or-less copy the Xone EQ style…they're +/- 16dB because of the constraints of EQ8 and the fact that the developer wasn't clever enough, but…they're out there. Even Ableton's EQ3 device has tunable crossovers.

Between that stuff and phase cancellation tricks, you have all of the customizable EQing you could ever want for a price.

It's just not worth the hassle, IMHO.

[TommyQuiet]

i love xone and tbh would rather own a 92 than pioneer 800 anyday

all the stuff i have bought from a&h has sounded great and never let me down

[djproben]

Actually, proben, Ableton can do everything you mentioned if you're clever enough with mapping.

Ahh yeah I hadn't thought about Ableton when I posted that comment -- I was thinking more DJ-centric software like Traktor, Serato, Torq, etc. But you're right, if you're adding Ableton (or one of those nifty hardware boxes) in just to mess with EQs you wind up doing way too much effort for effects that are more likely to cause trouble than make things sound better. That's why I like the way Pioneer is implementing the 7 band EQ as a bunch of virtual crossfaders -- it makes it really easy to incorporate much more fine-tuned EQing into a set without going through the trouble of tweaking things in another program on another controller.

In ancient Rome, Cato the Elder used to end every speech no matter what the topic by saying "Carthage must be destroyed." I think I'm going to start ending every post by saying "I need a DB4."

[V-Hoff]

I'm actually upping this old thread for it awesomess!
I use this info a lot and most of my friends doesn't know about it too... They are just pionner's fanboys :P

And I need to ask, where is the article about it? Who can write it?
This info is so damn cool that can't be lost in a simple random thread