Clipping & Line Levels

[BentoSan]

<3 this forum, learn something new all the time

I might just have to give autogain another shot, i have it turned off at the moment.

[Karlos Santos]

Keep in mind, technically, the order everything goes is

Track Gain (the level the track is recorded at) --> Gain --> EQ --> Volume --> Master.

And then it's plugged into another mixer that's going

Levels from Master in Traktor -->Gain --> EQ --> Volume --> Master Out

Then it's going to an amp, etc. etc. etc.

So, really, if Traktor is boosting the levels to 0.0 db based on its analysis, you want to make sure your EQ and Gain are spot on so that it won't clip. The clipping is, in my view, most likely to happen before you hit the volume faders, or the Master Out.

That make sense?

Yeah totally.
Thats why you have to take all things into consideration although i think EQ is after Volume because in older Traktor versions you could listen to the track Pre-Eq and thats what i have on my Vestax Mixer but thats not important.
But yeah its all interdependent . If you whack all the EQ up your likely to clip regardless of volumes. Thats the nature of heavy EQ.

Ive always worked by backing off the software and pushing the mixer.
If you push Traktor to hard it will sound shit.

[jmastio]

Hello guys I'm digging an old thread back.
I'm not DJing since a long time however I start to think about Gain adjustments and clipping stuff also.
Although I'm always using autogain function, I think it can still be usefull to know how to work with the gain knob, because sometimes the autogain function of Traktor does not always sounds nice to me.
First of all, I've not seen this mentionned in this thread but do you take into consideration headroom level ?
Because I'm wondering if I'm using autogain function and I set my master output to -7.5, it it usefull to use a limiter and also some headroom in preferences ?
I will have others questions about gain adjustments but I prefer to go slowly ;-)
Teach me and thank you
Jérôme

[jmastio]

Also I have seen that it is not advised to set the channel fader all the way up.
I do not understand why if you're using some headroom no ?
Thank you for your answers.

[Audeo]

No, the built-in limiter function of Traktor is a bit wonky and will pull your sound out of proportion to the bassy side. I prefer to have the master set to -10dB and not use auto-gain. Just keep using your head and not let it clip. You can check out the output in the middle on the top. Don't let it go blinking RED.

And I don't know who told you not to go 100% with your faders, but that seems quite useless and I see no reason to do something like that.
Only when I play two tracks at the same time, I have both faders @ 80% because combined they sound pretty loud.

And I don't know why someone would say that you'd have to put Pioneer mixers in the red do get decent sound because that's special olympics retarted. Seriously. If you have ANY knowledge about mixers and how they work, you really wouldn't say that.

[KS2]

Still struggling to get my head around this. I've been loading up a track, finding where it really kicks in and seeing if it hits the red (usually does slightly) then turning the gain down til it stops doing so. Haven't had any issues with sound but I doubt this is correct. I've got autogain set for when a track is loaded, limiter enabled and headroom of -9dB (don't know what this means!).

[djslik]

There is no good reason to not have the up faders all the way up.
1. Monitor your channels and keep them out of the RED with the combination of Trim and EQ.

2. Monitor your master output levels and keep it out of the RED.

3. IF you think you're not getting enough punch when you are running your mixer at the bleeding edge of clipping, then the truth of the matter is that you don't have an adequate sound system. It seems like a lot of people like to get MORE from their system by running the mixer way too hot. Bad idea and it sounds like shit period. Pony up the money and upgrade your amps and especially subs or find a venue with a better sound system. Most guys aren't usually mixing and think to themselves, damn there isn't enough symbals or high frequency sounds I'll turn up the highs. They usually go damn I wish I had more bass to make people vomit. Turn up the mixer levels and boom there goes your speaker or amp.

Most sound guys hate DJ's and usually limit the shit out of your mixer because they know you'll play in the red anyways cuz it's cool. I do the same thing if some DJ I don't know is going to play through my amps and speakers. Before a gig I turn all my levels to max including master, trim, and all eq's. Then I plug in my amps and run the system without speakers connected. I hook up a multimeter and measure max voltage with different sound frequencies and adjust the amp limiters to only allow the RMS power out to the speakers to keep them from blowing. This way if the DJ maxs out the mixer he has no way of blowing my gear up.

[djslik]

Still struggling to get my head around this. I've been loading up a track, finding where it really kicks in and seeing if it hits the red (usually does slightly) then turning the gain down til it stops doing so. Haven't had any issues with sound but I doubt this is correct. I've got autogain set for when a track is loaded, limiter enabled and headroom of -9dB (don't know what this means!).

If you really want to test your system run a frequency generator through your system and choose several frequencies to see what produces the loudest sound.

Usually I go for 50 Hz, 60 Hz, 90 Hz, 150 Hz, 200 Hz

This usually gives me a good spread and allows me to adjust the trim levels correctly. You will notice that one frequency will be much louder than the others. That is what you want to design your trim levels around. The problem is that not all songs are at the same levels and some might be recorded much louder. I always monitor the levels before I mix in and reduce or increase trim as necessary.

[TCMuc]

It's not that you shouldn't have your channel faders at 100%, it's that you don't have to... Many people use their channel faders almost like on/off witches, just slamming the fader up and down.

There are, however, some cases where you really should not have your faders at 100%: when you're using a minimalistic rotary mixer or any other mixer that does not have gain control. In this cases you should keep your faders at about 70%/80% so you don't have any problems if a tune should be more quite than the one playing before.

An there's an 'anomaly' on some mixers, e.g. the Xone mixers. With the Xones, 100% (or unity gain, to be correct) isn't at the top of the fader, but slightly below it. For the Xones that would be in the middle of the marked area next to the upper part of the fader. This means that by having the fader at 100%, you're actually adding some volume to the signal, e.g. if you set your gains so that the signal is at 0dB according to the LEDs, the signal would actually be above 0dB after the fader.

[djslik]

I stand corrected. Thanks for the insight on those mixers, why on earth would Xone do that with their line faders.