A disconnect I'm noticing in the culture
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  1. #1
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    Default A disconnect I'm noticing in the culture

    I've been noticing something more and more with gear lately on places like these forums:
    What I've noticed a lot is a circlejerk built around things like cheap all-in-one controllers (S2/S4/mixtrack) that are popular with newer/less established DJs who don't have much real world experience. There are definitely a lot of newer DJs, and bedroom DJs or DJs who aren't very established, skewing the general culture by talking a lot, but not knowing what they're talking about. This works because of the anonymity. Obviously if we were talking to these people in person we'd know not to take them seriously, because we could see how unestablished they are. There's not as much discussion about high-end gear as there should be in order to encourage it's use to the newbies.

    Anyone else noticed something similar?

  2. #2
    Tech Guru funke's Avatar
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    What would you consider high end a far as controllers? I think most people buy cheaper gear because djing is just a hobby for them or they don't want to drop big money on something they aren't sure is for them.
    Toshiba Satellite Windows 8.1, TSP2, Audio 10, Audio 2, 2x Technics 1200 MKII, Pioneer DJM-707, Midi Fighter Spectra, Kontrol X1, Behringer CMD PL-1

  3. #3
    Tech Guru DubluW's Avatar
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    Well i suppose its because if ask about a certain type of gear then you'll get a response from people with that gear. If you ask about high end stuff you'll get a response accordingly.

    There's nothing stopping anyone asking about whatever they want, and that goes from the bedroom DJ right through to anyone who does this for a living. Though i suppose if you've made it where you want to be in the world of DJ'ing then your not going to be asking about too much on a forum thats mainly populated by people who are mostly bedroom DJ's. And there's nothing wrong with that in the slightest.

  4. #4
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    As above.

    The cheaper end of the market is always going to be more popular, as it simply doesn't cost as much. Not everyone has 3k to drop on a pair of CDJ 2000's, and a further 1700 on a DB4 mixer. I mean, I got my Range Rover for less than that (Obviously not new).

    To be fair, when I sold my CDJ 350's, my intention was to go for a controller. More specifically the XDJ Aero. I went in to my local place for a look, and as impressed as I was, the lack of send / return, and minimal fx section kind of put me off. But I could totally see the point in such a machine. To me it would have been far more advanced than the CDJ 350's, and at a fraction of the cost.

    In the end, I also had a look at the DB4 mixer. What a mistake. Rather than selling my CDJ's and DJM 800 to consolidate my kit, and have money left over, I upped the budget, and got just the mixer. Luckily I have 1210's to run DVS on, but then I can actually afford to go this route. Probably the only one of my friends who can. Most wouldn't dream of spending 1.5k on a cd player, when they could get a semi-reasonable motor for that. Where-as me on the other hand, is considering doing just that.

    Less money = greater affordability = more buyers = more chat.

    Not much you can do about it really.
    Technics 1210 mk2's, Pioneer CDJ 500, Allen & Heath DB4, NI F1's (x2), Reloop Contour Controller Edition, Sennheiser HD25 1-II or Allen & Heath XD2-53's depending on my mood...

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  5. #5
    Moderator keithace's Avatar
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    Can't we just let everyone find their own way as far as gear is concerned?

    I came from Vinyl and CDJs. I started with an x-session pro, added a hercules piece of crap, added my gemini mixer, deleted the hercules, sold it all. Picked up a used mixtrack. Sold it. Bought an X1 and a Xone 22. Just added a LPD8. All this over the last three years or so. I am very comfortable with my setup. But it took all those steps for me to get there.
    Weapons, not food, not homes, not shoes
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  6. #6
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    Yeah that's definitely why it's happening, I just mean to suggest that the proportions are a bit off, and that's a bad thing. I keep seeing things like obvious newbies literally arguing that jogwheels are useless and nobody should use them. The balance is just off. For a while it was 90% of DJs hating on new school concepts, but now it seems like it's shifted because of the recent explosion in the DJ population.. At this point is seeems like 20% ignorant old schoolers hating on everything, 50% newbies who've been spinning for a year or two, and 30% people who actually know what they're talking about.

    I feel like there needs to be a greater degree of shutting-the-fuck-up within the 20% and the 50% blocks, so that the people who actually know what they're talking about can encourage both sides to improve.

  7. #7
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    Hope I'm in the 30% after 15 years of vinyl addiction, lol.
    Technics 1210 mk2's, Pioneer CDJ 500, Allen & Heath DB4, NI F1's (x2), Reloop Contour Controller Edition, Sennheiser HD25 1-II or Allen & Heath XD2-53's depending on my mood...

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  8. #8
    Moderator keithace's Avatar
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    I think the old schoolers are irked by the complete lack of respect shown by the new schoolers. The torrenting of music that is pretty cheap to buy now. Deadmau5's attitude, combined with his popularity, poisoning people's view of DJs and their craft. DJ Actors. etc...

    I was raised old school but grew up in a new school world. Photojojo is the same. We are both old men that have embraced the techonology and what it means to us. I know i can be a bit abrasive, but I also have alot of knowledge and experience and love to share it with people that are willing to listen.
    Weapons, not food, not homes, not shoes
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  9. #9
    Tech Guru sobi's Avatar
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    New guys who think they know more than actual experience gives them is nothing new. Even in the days of two techs and a mixer, we had that issue. Keithace more or less hit it on the head. New guys not respecting a lot of the old ways, or even acknowledging the importance of some of it is huge, and combined with dinosaurs who just refuse to evolve... it gives two crowds very big soapboxes to project a seemingly non-stop soap opera from. Meanwhile, guys who sort of embrace the truths of both sides, and leave the bullshit behind tend to have their message lost in the noise, regardless of the fact that they are the ones with the truest view of how things are and should be.

  10. #10
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    Exactly. My point is that right now the balance is off. It's so far off that it's not newbies vs old schoolers any more. The old schoolers have already lost... At this point it seems like it's the newbies vs EVERYONE ELSE. Even the people who are spinning on controllers just like the newbies, but actually know what they're doing/talking about.
    There are so many newbies expressing their unfounded opinions, that the culture is regressing (on forums like this), instead of progressing.

    I've been DJing for about five years, which sort of automatically puts me in between the old schoolers and the idiot newbies. I think the old schoolers and the newbies both have valid points in their argument... But the argument is over... now it's just anyone who's been DJing for more than two or three years, versus a legion of neckbeard 20-year-olds who want to be Madeon or Dillon Francis.

    I think we as a community might just need to start being louder in telling the newbies that they don't know what they're talking about...
    I swear, I dunno what I'm going to do if one more dork that's been transitioning between electrohouse and dubstep tracks for two years tries to argue that the S4 is a great controller...
    Last edited by whiskeyflip; 12-29-2012 at 04:14 PM.

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