S4 OUTPUT - TOTAL CONFUSION - Trs 1/4" Jack's are around louder than RCA's output

[cabledigital]

I dont expect everyone reading this to give a damn about achieving the highest quality sound output available but for me right now it's critical.

I'm starting to play more 'big club' gig's 1000+ ppl and I want to use the S4 cause it's so awesome to use, as its what im most comfortable on I only play WAV or Aiff. Beatgrid, hotkeys, loops, outro's, intro's the whole insane prep leading up to any gig!! Anyway I have a apple mac pro with 80+ gig space free and its going fine with traktor pro2.67.

My only problem is:

Getting the full balanced output to the pioneer mixers practically in every club i play at, 90% of clubs have a pioneer mixer, which DON'T support Trs 1/4" Jack inputs, RCA only.. unless they have a soundboard guy with an oldschool band mixer, and he has to be nice and work with you.. Not happening!! I'm fully aware of how the balanced leads are used as studio monitors etc. I'm not concerned about theory I know all that shit. Does Raine or Allen and Heath have Trs inputs? Am I on the wrong track here, if so no hate I'm just trying to learn what people around me in real life dont know.

I was recently told by a techtools staffer that Trs 1/4" Jack's are around louder than RCA's output, he said around 6db difference!!

How come this issue isnt being talked about AT ALL online!! So here I am..The forum. Pan Pot use the native instruments audio interface between traktor laptop and the mixer obviousley, I might need the newest interface from NI (Traktor Scratch Audio 10) I will get it even if it is $500..


Could someone please explain to me why I should settle for RCA's when there are better options?!? And I hope you get what I'm saying and can put my mind at ease here. I have some more events coming up and I would love to have everything locked down!!

Thanks for reading, if you could possibly link me to a thread that would be great Cheers

[Jester]

As long as you can connect to channel of a mixer, it doesn't matter whether you use TRS or RCA. Thats what gain knobs are for.

[cabledigital]

As long as you can connect to channel of a mixer, it doesn't matter whether you use TRS or RCA. Thats what gain knobs are for.

Hey jester thanks for you straight fwd thoughts. Unfortunately that answer is unsatisfactory for me personally. Some ppl are fine with relying on gain knobs. Top performing artist that use the S4 like Porter Robinson, Frontliner, Pete Tong n panpot all achieve that high quality thump that cdj's have and I'd put money on it that they aren't using Rca's. So Jester I'd rather have the highest quality data along with Highest Quality output. I'm convinced there is no easy answer but hope I'm wrong Every one claims Rca's will do the job, yeah I know I've been djing for 15 years with them! Thanks anyway boss

[SlayForMoney]

You would achieve a far better improvement in sound quality simply by using a different controller (not that S4 is bad) than connecting S4 via TRS vs. RCA.
The difference between TRS vs RCA in such cases (1-2m cable) in inaudible, that's why you haven't read any topics. TRS and XLR cables are usually used when it's needed to transfer the signal to a distant input (amp or speakers that are 10+m away from the controller) not to a mixer that's 1m away.

[DanteBen]

If you're so set on the audio output from the jack instead of the RCA ports, why not just get some 6.5mm mono TRS to mono RCA adaptor cables like these?

UXL-PJR2.jpg

Problem solved!

[Jester]

Unless you are using shitty quality RCA's, there is zero difference in signal quality between the two connector types, this isn't something you should be worried about dude.
Also, most dj mixers only use TRS for FX Returns/Sends & Mics.

[FilthyDave]

It's the difference between an unbalanced (RCA) and a balanced connection (TRS).

A balanced signal is more capable of rejecting electro-magnetic interference over long distances.

As SlayForMoney says the difference over 1-2m isn't noticable and I really wouldn't worry about it at all and just use the RCA's

If you were going directly into the system bypassing a DJ mixer then I'd use the TRS but realistically unless it's your system and you're the only DJ on (or everyone is using your gear) that's never going to happen

If you really are desperate to use the TRS connectors Ch1 & 2 on the A&H Xone 92 have them

[mostapha]

I was recently told by a techtools staffer that Trs 1/4" Jack's are around louder than RCA's output, he said around 6db difference!!

It's the difference between balanced and ubalanced levels, and that's just the way it is. Changing it would requirely, literally, everything that's been made since the beginning of analog audio to change their standards.

How come this issue isnt being talked about AT ALL online!!

Because it's not an issue. It never has been, unless you're using 20+ foot long RCA cables.

Could someone please explain to me why I should settle for RCA's when there are better options?!?

The difference is not audible in a club, or really anywhere unless you have some of the best ears on the planet (like....statistical anomoly good). If you've ever been to a club without earplugs, your ears aren't good enough. If the room and sound system aren't fanatically tuned to each other, you won't hear it even if they are.

The difference is a few db in the volume of the noise floor, which pretty much means it's only going to be audible for the very end of reverb tails and the end of the release of sounds when nothing else is happening. The rest of the time, it's plain inaudible. If that sound was sampled off vinyl, it's inaudible (vinyl's noise floor is louder). If it came out of pretty much any analog synth or drum machine, it's inaudible (their noise floors are louder).

Some ppl are fine with relying on gain knobs.

Like every single person who has ever touched a mixer in any context anywhere, from $20 budget DJ mixers to multi-million dollar recording consoles.

Top performing artist that use the S4 like Porter Robinson, Frontliner, Pete Tong n panpot all achieve that high quality thump that cdj's have and I'd put money on it that they aren't using Rca's.

Unless they're running into the FOH mixer (which you already discounted), you would be wrong.

I kind of can't believe anyone is praising CDJs sound more than Traktor's. I'd bet money that if you hear a difference, it's because you don't know how to run the mixer and are either clipping the master out or squashing all the dyanmic out of your sound by constantly slamming into the limiter.

[c0nsul]

The difference between TRS vs RCA in such cases (1-2m cable) in inaudible, that's why you haven't read any topics. TRS and XLR cables are usually used when it's needed to transfer the signal to a distant input (amp or speakers that are 10+m away from the controller) not to a mixer that's 1m away.



That´s right!

If you still want to use the TRS outputs of your controller, then unplug the pioneer mixer and connect the XLR cables via an adapter with the TRS outputs your controller..

[mostapha]

If you still want to use the TRS outputs of your controller, then unplug the pioneer mixer and connect the XLR cables via an adapter with the TRS outputs your controller.

The problem with that is that it's more complicated to do without silence.

I've definitely traded out mixers during a night....but it's not a trivial proposition.