Beat Juggling
= triggering samples via cue points?
discuss
Yes, in the same way that placing warp markers is the equivalent of beatmatching.
Thanks for the reply!
yeah.. thats what I was thinking.
The reason I ask is because I wasn’t sure what the common view on it was.
I’ve never seen a routine like that be called beat juggling before.
I’m not saying it is or it isn’t.. it just sparked my curiosity and I wanted to get other’s view points!
beat juggling = DMC like
cue juggling = Ean like
my 2 €cent, keep discussing
cue juggling.. I like that!!
So the term beat juggling will die when the vinyl guys die? It can never be used for anything else? No one’s allowed to say it ever again?
The above is not necessarily my opinion, just adding a little accelerant to the flame.
While I see your point, we’re essentially comparing chess (vinyl beat juggling) to tic-tac-toe (cue point juggling). The skill of pushing cue buttons in time ≠ the skill of turntablism juggling.
safe..
I think if you were to use two decks you could beat juggle digitally..
but triggering samples from a single deck doesn’t really seem like beat juggling..
..not that I can’t see where its coming from!
I think comparing cue juggling to tic-tac-toe is a disservice. From the outside it might look as easy as tic tac toe, but coming up with a good routine is not. the biggest difference in the cue juggling and beat juggling is the ease in which it is to repeat the routine. With vinyl you’re starting from scratch, but with cues it’s all preset.
What about setting cues on the fly with no pre planning mid set and then performing a short routine? Is that more difficult than performing a rehearsed beat juggling routine?
You would probably stick to a rehearsed pattern but with different sounds so there’s no reason for it to work out with on the fly sounds
Do you mean not to work out?
And the whole point is you’re not playing a rehearsed pattern, but more like just jamming on the drums. It’s probably impractical to think you could set the cue points live as that really takes to much time I think. Even if you’ve got 8 set cue points and you’re playing them similar to the way you would just jam on the drums without rehearsing a specific routine has got to get more respect than tic-tac-toe.
IMO..
cueing on the fly and banging out a beat is still a lot easier than beat juggling.
Also, i think it will take a lot less time to come up with a good routine via cue points, than actual vinyls.
I’m not saying one is better than the other..
digitally, it seems like you have more options.. you get 8 samples a track, and can basically do anything in any order down to 32nd notes (more or less depending on your ability) and obviously you can delete and re cue on the fly if you have to.
Vinyl.. you are more free(not limited to 8 samples at a time) but navigating between different samples is a lot more difficult and takes up more time, and also 32nd notes with varying hits/samples is going to be quite the challenge. But you have more option of manipulating the sound on the fly.. reverse, slowing it down, scratching, etc.
I guess the point I’m trying to make is that they are totally different skills.
when I hear beat juggling done digitally I think.. bouncing between 2 (or more) tracks and making a choppy beat. Not triggering cues as samples on a single deck!
Cue juggling is definitely easier, but doing it well is not easy. Or at least as easy as some might think. How many times do we get old school vinyl guys on here that are trying out controllers, but can’t figure out something that we might take for granted?
The skill sets are different, but a good digital DJ that can manipulate music like a turntabelist does is still largely reliant on being able to “feel” certain things, having the correct timing and talent in general.
Common Denominator?
PRACTICE!
They both need practice!
I usually do a lot on the fly, i have a 32 beat jump button so usually play a song and then set the next on my cue points so i can lengthen it etc whilst going along, recently fixed my nanopad so ready to rock and roll again 
just need a new usb hub
Sarasin is right, the important thing is practice in both cases, but beat juggling is a skill that takes an awful lot of time to learn.
Consider this, with vinyls you have a lot of stuff you need to work out just to be able to do a back to back on the same song :
- weight of the cartridge
- depth of the groove in the vinyl
- is the vinyl warped
- humidity of the room ( seems silly i know, but if it’s humid, then the slipmat won’t slip like you are used to )
Rewinding the record every time in the same way is real difficult, doing it on time even more, doing it repeatedly on time with two vinyls takes an insane amount of practice ( i’m not saying cue d¡juggling doesn’t).
But the creative part between cue and beat juggling is the same, you work on it till you are more capable of coming up with ideas ( prepared or on the fly ), the timing thing is the same, i don’t care that you use vinyl or cue points, if you don’t have the groove, if you aren’t on time, it doesn’t matter, it’s failed.
The difference is i have never seen a cue point skip 
What Photojojo said: I think they really are 2 different skill sets, kind of like comparing apples to oranges.
That said, I think if you grabbed 2 DJs (one who has only spun vinyl and one who has only ever played digitally), I think the digital DJ would have a harder time learning to beat juggle than the vinyl DJ learning to cue juggle.
chess and tic tac toe is not a fair comparison…apples and oranges is right…they are both good…and different…and some like one but not the other…and vice versa…
I don’t see it like that at all. If you have a good ear, and know your track/tracks, all thats left is to mash buttons. There isn’t nearly as much hand/eye coordination as there is with regular juggling. I honestly can’t even believe that they are being compared.
I agree.
Vinyl is not accurate in terms of beat consistency. Riding the pitch is what prevents a train wreck. A person, who played vinyl before Traktor came into the market, will more than likely mix as if they were playing Technics 1200s.
Cue Juggling is merely timing which, is standard with those who mix vinyl.