Mixing Harmonically ... I never really see it discussed here.

[SpeshulEd]

Ha, sorry, I didn't mean to be rude, just that you said it's never talked about and it is...but yeah, it usually just happens randomly.

Personally, I think we all try to mix harmonically. I used the chart religiously when I started but now I don't even pay attention. I think as a beginner it helps you learn what goes together but the more you play and become familiar with your style/tunes you play the less you have to rely on the chart. I can usually tell if a song sounds like hell with the song I'm playing, so I skip it and find another song. I've also found songs that should go together based on key but don't, sometimes you just have to rely on your ear and what sounds right to you.

[jshawpro]

I've also found songs that should go together based on key but don't, sometimes you just have to rely on your ear and what sounds right to you.

Thanks for the reply. No worries at all! I don't take much offense to the delicate art of forum etiquette ... But will defend my usually pretty fair position.

Maybe I should've titled the post "how do YOU mix harmonically [advanced only]" ...

Because my intent was for comments just like I quoted from you to emerge. You beat me to the punch. Now the question is (more for myself) ... do you know why the tracks won't blend properly when they should. I strive to understand everything within my capacity about the micro details of harmonic mixing ... so like I said ... one day, I can fully harness the amazing (to me) potential of harmonic mixing / manipulation.

I find tracks and key codes that should not work ... then after verifying the key manually w/ a synth ... and then repeating the effect sometimes with other songs of the same variables ... I'm left boggled ... Like ... why does that work so perfectly! And my nature will not allow me to be unsatisfied.

I can anticipate the next response ... "Sounds like you need to get a chord book and learn some theory" ... and that is true ... and I will.

[LiamC]

In my experience, there are sort of three different categories that a tune may fall into given how much its harmony makes it feel like it has a tonal centre (the key it is in - major or minor). First is atonal - such as atmospheric techno with no real melody and maybe only one repeated bass note. Something with very atonal sounding melodies also falls into this category (jump up drum n bass, brostep, some bass music, etc..). The second category is something that has very little melody - maybe one or two different notes, probably the same bass note repeate.d throughout. Dutch house comes to mind.. or more melodic techno. The third category is completely tonal - there is a very clear harmonic progression (think very melodic things such as liquid dnb, disco, trance).

In my experience, the importance of using the circle of fifths (i key all my tracks entirely by ear) is only based on how tonally centred the new track's key is versus the old track's key. You can mix atonal music with anything (that is, any key and any amount of melody) , and it either wont matter or will sort of take on the tonal centre in a way of a more melodic track. A track that has a bit more melody and tonal centre will always sound good with atonal things, but has to be somewhat compatible with a very melodic track. It doesn't necessarily have to be within a fifth, but if the keys are a semitone apart will most likely sound awful. If you are mixing two tracks with a great deal of melody, mix them according to the circle of fifths. It will almost always sound bad if you dont. Keep in mind that different parts of the tracks have different amounts of melody, like what he said above about percussion loops (ATONAL!). An outro might only have one repeated note - so you can likely move to a more distant key without any sort of awful clash.

I started out using keys religiously from a key detection program. It got it wrong too often for me, so i did it on my own. It takes me about 2 seconds to find a key if it's obvious now. I highly recommend this. The point of this is don't always follow key codes, but sometimes you need to in order to confidently blend things.

[SirReal]

SirReal's a bit of a sarcastic fellow at times. I wouldn't take that to heart

<---------I have been know to be a bit sarcastic but rarely, if ever, is there any malice attached to it.

[keeb]

<---------I have been know to be a bit sarcastic but rarely, if ever, is there any malice attached to it.

That jives with my impression.

[Jester]

There are a lot of discussions on this topic in the forum, and several blog articles relating to it.

[jshawpro]

Umm. Thanks.

There are a lot of discussions on this topic in the forum, and several blog articles relating to it.

[Zer0beet]

Oh yeah?

The circle of fifths is a guide. Once you've tuned your ears to what a harmonic mix sounds like, you can branch out. I'll do about every third mix or so "out of harmony" based on the wheel while still making sure the tracks sound good together as I'm cueing the next track; whether that means finding a part of the song where the melody still works, or finding a part that's just percussion. The groove is more important than harmonic "correctness" in my experience, though not much will beat mix that's sound in both areas.

Another thing is to make sure you have options in each key for whatever genre you're spinning. If you only have one track that's 11A/11B and you "need" to mix through 11, it gets a lot harder after you've already used that track. You'll also find yourself gravitating toward worse tracks if you focus too much on the harmony with a small selection and forget about the rest of your mixing fundamentals. Oh, and epic comes from dedication, years of practice, good taste, and passion. Harmonic mixing is a solid component too, but don't let it trap you into formulaic mixes.

What he said

[Emery]

I use a freeware program called "KeyFinder" and I've been happy with it. The info, imo, is nice to have , but whether or not I use it when I mix depends on the gig/type of music and where Im mixing one track into another. If it is over the drum beat, obviously tone doesn't matter. I also think that using your ear should ALWAYS be the final judge.

Personally I avoid MIK because I despise their marketing ploy of "With MIK anyone can DJ like Tiesto!" We can all agree that there is much more too the art than that, but It is nice information to have and use appropriately

[LiamC]

I really do recommend manually keying tracks.. you will probably learn a lot. 99% of everything uses either Major mode, or aeolian mode (natural minor scale - like the major scale but flat 3, flat 6, and flat 7) - for example C major is all the white keys on the piano starting on C, and A minor is all the white keys on the piano starting on A. Must be why so many tracks are in A minor or 8A!

Key detection software does kind of suck. I also use the key knob to go up or down one semitone (more options for harmonic mixing) - using "A minor, D minor" etc.. is way easier than using those silly key codes as well.