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  1. #91
    Tech Mentor Joel Santos's Avatar
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    Well i don't know why... the forum didn't send me any email saying that someone had replied!
    So with much appreciation... I see a lot of ideas around!
    Thanks to all...

    For those who asked for buttons under knobs... top row of knobs has a button, they're keyswitch encoders.

    I kind of like that approach to APC. I kind of agree with arcade buttons, the problem with silicone buttons, like the ones of the APC, is it's price. For that... you need a sensitive pad, like all the akai. Tried to find a suppier who already has something and... sparkfun has some but... kind of expensive for a project like this, still... maybe it's really the way.

    I'm maturing my idea, maybe loops+effects isn't the way, maybe the way is more an approach to "whatever you want it to be". Some space under each control so people can label it.
    So here is the thing, someone said, and fairly, that it's hard to make something that works well on traktor and ableton (ergonomics)... This is still the question yes...

    So i'm really wondering... I loved those mockups but tell me... who of you would give 200e/250e or more for something like that? It's really an interesting idea but... would you give that kind of money?

  2. #92
    Tech Guru deevey's Avatar
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    Include a USB hub, espessially if this is going to be more of a "companion" controller ... I dont get why no-one else does it .

  3. #93
    Tech Guru MrPopinjay's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nem0nic View Post
    No, you don't. The APC40 uses encoders with LED rings just fine and needs no middleware. The encoders on the APC40 just send an absolute message instead of relative. This is easily done in the device firmware. If you wanted to be especially crafty, you could put in a SYSEX message or "magic keypress" to switch the encoder behavior over from absolute to relative.
    If you read my post it said program or firmware. In fact it says it in the bit of post I quoted. I gave the APC40 as an example the same way you did.

    Yeah it's a neat idea the whole switch thing, no one seems to be doing it though with firmware. I guess it'd be an extra button on the hardware that average users might find confusing. I like the novation nocturn as their software seems to handle this shit the best. The array of different signals the encoders can put out is stunning! You can even have the left and right positions on the knob be two different knobs!
    The xwax Thread! - The minimal open source DVS for Linux!
    Reddit's /r/DJs! - Another great DJ community!

  4. #94
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    Quote Originally Posted by nem0nic View Post
    Right. I agree completely. So where are the required buttons for effect control? Are they the buttons below the knobs? If so, why disassociate the 2 groups? That makes the controller less intuitive.


    There are functional groups that imply a workflow. For example, if I have a fader and 3 unlabeled pots above it, are you really saying that most users won't decide to map those pots to EQs HI/MID/LOW top to bottom? How about if there is a linear fader next to a platter. If the fader isn't labeled PITCH, do you really think any user will be confused about it's implied functionality? Think they'll try mapping that big platter to the volume?

    Probably not. We work with these functional groups every day. There are unwritten rules for product design that apply to ALL classes of product. Good design means that the product should be intuitive.


    I'm not saying it's easy. Quite the opposite. And if you start off with bad design, your job is that much harder.


    You have no idea what you're talking about here. First of all, they're not a manufacturer. They rebadge stuff from ODMs (mostly Hanpin) and sell it. Second of all, they're not fast growing (mostly because their distribution model is terrible).


    Even if that's the intended goal, good design is a must or your sales will be severely limited.


    But again, the problem isn't that the functions aren't known. It's a matter of workflow. If I have to spread a functional group out, that breaks up the workflow and makes things harder to use. Most of the time, this isn't even something you think about directly - you just realize that using thing X is uncomfortable or distracting. When you experience this, most of the time it can be attributed to a design flaw.


    DJTT doesn't make VCI-100s.


    And the MIDI Fighter has a very clear and proven workflow. A 4 x 4 grid of buttons used to "perform" sounds has been used since 1988 (where it appeared on the original MPC60).
    Good god... you were very determined to win this debate so I'll just let you have it. Man oh man... You even contradict yourself. Just forget I mentioned anything, alright?
    Last edited by ToOntown; 07-13-2011 at 10:33 PM.

  5. #95
    Tech Guru MrPopinjay's Avatar
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    Honestly dude I think nem0nic is one of the guys guaranteed to more about this stuff than you and almost certainly has a more educated view on how the business of DJ equipment works.
    The xwax Thread! - The minimal open source DVS for Linux!
    Reddit's /r/DJs! - Another great DJ community!

  6. #96
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    Quote Originally Posted by MrPopinjay View Post
    Honestly dude I think nem0nic is one of the guys guaranteed to more about this stuff than you and almost certainly has a more educated view on how the business of DJ equipment works.
    +1 for nem0.

    :eek: nem0nic for president :eek:

  7. #97
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    Quote Originally Posted by MrPopinjay View Post
    Honestly dude I think nem0nic is one of the guys guaranteed to more about this stuff than you and almost certainly has a more educated view on how the business of DJ equipment works.
    Yeah I've been here long enough to know who nem0nic is.

    Just ignore that... I was in a bad mood last night.

    @nem0nic, I ain't mad atcha. Thanks for the knowledge.

    But come on, I know DJTT doesn't make VCI-100s! But they do sell custom overlays. That's what I was referring to.

    Anyway... I'm kinda bored with this thread.
    Last edited by ToOntown; 07-14-2011 at 12:24 PM.

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