It’s not broken at all. I do live gigs with it all the time. Just two days ago in fact.
By that I mean that when you release hundreds of different models as HP have, you are bound to get it right eventually with one of them.
No Argument, Windows 7 is pretty stable when freshly installed, but when you buy a computer should you really need to do a fresh install or tweak it so it works correctly ?
Fortunately for you, yours one is the exceptions rather than what is the norm and as you mentioned you had to replace the default OS to get it stable (time + money).
I never actually reinstalled windows 7 when I think about it. I just installed it over vista. It was free as well and took about an hour in total. I never tinkered with anything at all. It just worked as is. There is this weird bias that you need to be some kind of computer genius to work with windows, and it’s simply not true. My desktop computers have averaged a lifespan of about 7 years and they were only replaced because if higher software demands. All of them have run windows. The only upgrades I did to those was a better graphics card or more ram. And that’s also because of higher software demands.
How do you know I am an exception? I know lots of people that use their laptop or desktop for ages.
Well, I was talking about cheaper laptops. Yours is a top end model and is rightly so still under the living. Here’s a piece from notebook review on your HP :
"The HP EliteBook 8530w is the latest 15.4″ workstation featuring the latest Intel processors and Nvidia Quadro FX 770M wrapped inside an impressively durable shell. The Elitebook 8530w and 8530p (non-workstation version) replace the 8510w and 8510p, respectively. Is it time for an upgrade at your office? Take a look and see what we have to say about this powerful workhorse!
The 8530w starts out at $1,499 but more powerful configurations top out at $3,549."
And that’s the point I was trying to make, for similar quality you will pay similar prices. A mate of mine runs a computershop and they get flooded with faulty cheap laptops. They get send back if they’re still in warranty, but otherwise you just got to buy a new one because they aren’t even bothering with repairs.
You are completely right, you don’t need to be a computer genius to work windows, and if you have a decent machine with decent drivers available, and do things by the book e.g. surf safe 100% of the time, uninstall all the in-built Crapware on day1 .. and you’ll probably be fine for a long time.
However most people do not, and accept that the email they got offering of $100 free money is legit and end up replacing their machine because its “running slow”, not due to hardware issues, but socially engineered vulnerabilities that are exploited on the windows platform.
Great, you don’t do anything stupid, I commend you.
Yes, the average person can use windows, but IMHO the average person is incapable of maintaining it over a long period of time or when things go even slightly pear shaped - many don’t do anything intensive enough to realize that their computer is running slower than it should.
On Call Service engineer for 12+ years, and about 80% of the callouts were down to users downloading crap, bad software installs or in some cases just not shutting down their computer correctly would cause OS corruption. In short, people tend to tinker and try things out. Don’t even get me started on them installing their own antivirus packages!
Yes, I can maintain windows just fine, and still do for certain software, however, I choose to make my own life easier by not worrying about the next program I update causing an un-recoverable BSOD, by using a “native” version itunes to manage my music, using core audio instead of propriety drivers, and using an operating system that has been developed solely to work really really well with one manufacturers very reliable hardware.
The hardware in a Mac is no more reliable than a top of the line Alienware or Asus, sure. Maybe if OSX was available for any old $1500 computer I’d probably buy one. But that would sacrifice reliability and stability, as the drivers would then need to be just as reliable across thousands of differently configured machines. Its the entire OS and ecosystem that you buy into with Macs that makes and keeps things stable.
Anyhow a PC of comparable specs to a Macbook Pro e.g. Dell XPS 15’ is almost the same price @ $2400.
[QUOTE]Please, you need to install a separate app to prevent a mac going into sleep when you close a lid on it. Need I say more?
[/QUOTE]
Only if you do not have a secondary display connected, which you normally would if you are closing the lid.
No, you don’t. You need to have a display and a keyboard connected to it. And the fact that app exists is proof that you can tweak it. The only reason you would need the app is that you don’t know how to do it yourself, so some developer decided to make it easier for you.
Seriously, what can you do with Windows that you can’t do with OS X?
Close a lid on my laptop during a gig without it going to sleep and shuting down the music. Enough for you?
No, because OS X can do that either with an app or writing your own little utility. If it did that by default, my laptop battery would be constantly discharging and would shorten its life.
Run Windows Media Player
Use Microsoft Paint
Install Norton Utilites and Spybot Search and Destroy
Format c:
Important Stuff like that 
Run Windows Media Player - That’s a preference. I hate WMP when I have to use it. Cog is my preferred player.
Use Microsoft Paint - paintbrush has been available for years. Seahorse is similar but a little more powerful. Gimp is like photoshop without the good select tools and free (though I think it’s available on windows too).
Install Norton Utilites and Spybot Search and Destroy - Screw Norton. I use Clam, which is free and updated just as fast and is the same thing I use on my linux and bsd boxes.
Format c: - I still think drive letters are stupid, but that’s a preference thing. diskutil reformat /dev/disk0s2 does what you want up until the system crashes. And diskutil is more poweful than the disk utilities available on CLI for windows. Expanding on that a little bit, Disk Utility (the graphical app) vs. MS’s disk and volume management software is largely a matter of preference, but I’ll admit that the graphical Disk Utility has it’s problems…that 90% of users are never going to encounter. There are 3rd party applications for both platforms that provide better management of more complicated disk things (e.g., complex raid setups). But, really, when you get into things like that, Linux and the BSDs provide better support for next gen filesystems than Windows or OS X.
I’m really surprised you didn’t mention gaming. 'cuz that’s one thing where Windows just wins. Also certain business software that I don’t care about and works fine inside a VM anyway.
Dude! - Sarcasm Mode
I intentionally picked the ones no-one should ever really run 
Out of the box, a Mac already ships with office apps, decent audio manager, decent photo editor/manager, audio production software, a full suite of development tools and Malware Blocker (invisible) and all for free.
And in the case of the audio production and photo editing software they can be completely seamlessly upgraded with pro versions at a reasonable price.
Completely forgot about gaming TBH, been a while, haven’t installed bootcamp since Yosemite and just a few run a few small things I need in a VM Anyhoo.
Sorry. I didn’t catch the sarcasm.
It’s obvious which side I fall on.
Right now I’m trying to decide whether a 5k iMac is worth the cost compared to upgrading the video card in my hackintosh to run all of my screens (a 4k and 2 1080ps) (which works perfectly under linux but doesn’t seem to work at all under ML). Considering how much I can actually fit into an eATX case (drives, cards, etc.), the iMac5K costs about $2000 more. But, it’s also a much nicer display than the 4k I have now.
Third party app isn’t a OS. Isn’t the whole point of a OSX that you don’t need to install third party apps/drivers? Or at least, that’s what mac users keep telling as one of the biggest advantages of OSX (please refer to the posts on this thread as example)?
mostapha, I must admitt, I am pulling your chain a little here - I totally agree with you - if you can afford it mac is the best choice for music production/DJing. But I don’t like people not admitting flaws/giving credit
Yeah…I don’t see how it’s a flaw. Complaining that the little apps to do things like that are too big or unwieldy is valid…linux’s monolithic kernel and the revent debate over sysvinit + text files vs. systemd + dbus is one example. Huge dorks, at least the huge dorks that came out of or respect the unix tradition (like me) definitely know what we like. And while OS X uses launchd instead of sysvinit, it’s still closer than where debian and redhat are taking linux for the low-level stuff.
Most of my personal problems with OS X have to do with the GUI or the recent (read: last several years) signs of “core rot” that don’t come up for most users and are generally solvable by using 3rd party userspace tools and/or avoiding it for servers.
I do have some problems with Apple hardware in that their trashcan mac pro makes mid-range-pro studio setups (for basically any discipline; music, photo, video, animation, etc.) more expensive…since it just has thunderbolt and usb3 and most of the hardware you need uses PCIe, SATA/SAS, and sometimes firewire…which means adapters and expensive external chases. And these problems extend to basically all of their hardware in one way or another.
But, like I said, that mostly affects mid-level-pros, since the really big PT/MC systems already needed external PCIe expansion chases 'cuz the motherboards in the older tower Mac Pros didn’t have enough anyway. I mean…heck, if I end up buying a 5K iMac instead of upgrading my hackintosh, I’ll be spending an extra $500 over the hardware just for a little box that turns 1 Thunderbolt port into a TB port, an HDMI port, some junk I’m not going to use, and has space for 2 2.5" SATA3 drives.
Still solvable…just expensive. And the pro industries are catching up. Apollo, TC, Avid, et al have released TB hardware. But, it’s a little less wholistically pleasing than the new Mac Pro’s design seems to imply they’re going for. And you wind up with the beautiful computer that they spent a lot of time on and built really well…with something the size of a mid tower sitting next to it that’s made up of a bunch of ugly boxes, probably from various manufacturers that are all slightly different sizes…or you pay even more to put those things in a short depth rack case.
These are the things that make me annoyed when people say that they’re for people who don’t know computers. They only really come up if you’re doing things that 90%+ of home users never even consider, and they’re solvable if you really know what you’re doing.
Really…the thing that would make me completely happy with Apple again is if they actually recognized the hackintosh community and sold OS X releases to us instead of forcing us into the grey area where we’re breaking the license terms and they simply choose not to prosecute anyone. Well…that and the fact that my Thinkpad (running linux) will run my 4K display using the integrated i5 graphics, but I can’t get my MBP or my hackintosh to run it and can’t figure out what video card or OS X I need to run. The laptop doesn’t run it well, but it does run it. And neither the i7 nor the xeon e3 (which both run OS X) will do it with or without my crappy nvidia card. Maybe I need to try the Radeon that’s in the new Mac Pros.
I think it’s that 4K only works on Yosemitie. And none of my software works on Yosemite yet…which is crazy. That 4K monitor has been the absolute best upgrade I’ve made in years. It changed my life as much as ditching Windows (to move to linux, then OS X, then a mix of linux and OS X) back in 2004.
So…I guess my message to the OP is that if s/he has the money for it, is willing to deal with a computer that’s harder to upgrade with aftermarket parts, and is only planning on doing things that the hardware is capable of, yes…the MBP is absolutely worth it.
well good news. I got the new Macbook Pro. Didn’t get the 2.5Ghz model since they won’t ship to japan and the stores here refused to take american debit card due to the currency conversion. But regardless I got one and I am impressed with it so far.
You are going to want the highest possible performance you can afford. And that almost always shifts focus back to a PC. Usually a PC with comparable specs to a high performance mac book can be had for cheaper. You just got to do your homework on the particular model… If you dont want to do the research than you know what you’re getting with the mac…
So…just because this seems as good of place to complain as any, I’ve spent some spare time over the last couple days trying to figure out how the heck to get my seiki 4K display to work either with my hackintosh or with my MBP. And apparently the problem is that apple only supports a small handfull of 4K displays…and except for the 24" dell (which seems ridiculously stupid), they all cost more than the whole damn computer (i7, 32gb ram, RAID0 PCIe SSD), did.
So, uhh…in that regard…fuck apple. My little lenovo laptop can run that display (4K@30Hz) on integrated i5 graphics, and apparently no Apple can run it at all without carefully massaging out a sub-18Hz signal.
Under linux it’s literally 3 commands that take all of 30 seconds if you type slow…generate a modeline, add it to xrandr, and switch to it. Screen blinks off and back on and never screws up again.
So, in other words, to have a half-decent sized screen, I have to pay $1400+ for a display or buy a 5K iMac with just barely too small of a screen.
Do yourself a favor and don’t get used to 4K if you use Apple or you’ll really see all of your money flying away.
Thats an opinion, not a fact.
Most of the pc v mac thing just comes down to superstition, not technical details.
OSX Core Audio is excellent, but not worth buying a mac for alone.
For the record ive supported both macs and pcs for a living, and have no professional preference, but at home all my pcs are windows and all my portable devices IOS. Go figure.
We have macs come in every day for routing breakfixing and software problems, in about the same proportion as PCs.
If you prefer OSX then get a mac and be happy, they are excellent PCs. But Windows is a mature product now, I simply dont get crashes or viruses and havent for years at this point.
I think the reason people prefer OS X for music stuff is that it doesn’t have an equivalent of DPCs and generally works better with things that need real time processing.
That being said, it’s a solvable issue on most Windows PCs. And with the way Apple’s hardware has been going, their creative use dominance might come to an end in the next several years, at least for amateurs.
That mostly ended years ago. Most bigger studios use PCs, most film post production and FX work is done on PCs/Linux. The only real vestige is audio users as Coreaudio is arguably superior than windows audio. People who say things like Apple is the industry standard are just regurgitating the wisdom from a decade ago. Things have changed a lot since then.
Apple is largely a consumer product now. I put laptops for DJs in the consumer box as they arent workstations by any measure.
Their tools for enterprise management are laughable and their after sales support turnaround is way below whats expected for professional usage.