MIDI-controller for scratching!
I know that I should pick up some TTs to scratch, but I’d rather have one or two MIDI-controllers to do that.
My VCI-100 is good and all, but the 7bit-midi-message isn’t just enough.
Can anyone recommend any MIDI-controllers for that task (customizing them a little would be ok as well)?
Which controller’s 14 bit messages are supported by Traktor already?
What Not To DO
Whatever you do, don’t get an SCS3D and try and scratch with it. This will bring disgrace and insanity into your life.
You will begin to imagine large crowds gathering around you to watch in awe whenever you show it off in public.
The halucinations will include dozens and dozens of e-mails asking you to please share your secrets and TSIs.
Tragic delusions will include, but not be limited to, the inability to tell if the cute little waveforms in Traktor are moving in conjunction with your hand.
You will be put on trial in every turntablist forum on the planet as a treacherous scoundrel who practises the most unholy of deceptions against the dj community.
And worst of all, you will have to argue with and explain yourself to, every fraudulent, duplicitous, mountebank DJ who ever owned a turntable.
Does it work that good for scratching?
I tried it once but wasn’t that impressed.
I’m rather looking for something with real platterns.
from what I hear the VCI 300 is much better for scratching than the VCI 100.
+1, I have a VCI-300 and it works perfect for scratching. I am unfamiliar with the vci-100 so I have no reviews for comparison. You should be able to youtube some videos because there is a lot showing the capabilities.
wow, just wow, did an scs3d assault someone you know or something?
I use 2 of these together with deckadance in ableton live, you will absolutely need bomes mt to scratch properly with them, the native speed of scratching on these is just not responsive, after adjusting the speed and reaction time of the scratch controls in bomes I’ve got it working really well.
No. Bad DJs! BAD DJs!
If you’re gonna scratch PLEASE just use a turntable and a mixer!!! If not - use a VST by Image-Line called Gross Beat for your scratch sounds. Fruity Loops also has an amazing scratch effect called Fruity Scratcher. Use Fruity Loops as a VST in your host…
Anything you’re doing in BMT to alter the CC messages used to scratch is downgrading what’s coming off the platter - ESPECIALLY if you’re using Deckadance. If you’re suggesting otherwise, please tell us what magic upsampling technique you’re using to make them MORE sensitive, and how you’re managing NOT to overflow and crash Deckadance’s MIDI buffer.
BTW Mike, Drimachus was being sarcastic. He’s probably the biggest authority on using the SCS.3 controllers for scratching, and pulls off some amazing stuff.
How about you let individuals choose the tools they feel most comfortable with. You’re on a controllerist forum here, and you’re suggesting that users either (a) don’t use a controller, or (b) use a ham-fisted plugin? Good call.
I cant see why that would be a problem to scratch using equipment other than turntables? These platters that are on the controllers like the VCI-100/300 and the Numark NS7 do the same but are designed on a smaller scale using sensors… there are plenty of professional DJ’s that have gone from turntablism to controllerism and are able to perform just as well or better in scratching…
No there aren’t. What James Zabiela does is not scratching.
I really gotta think about firing my press agent
+1
Certainly downgrading in the sense that passing any message through more than one software application WILL cause additional latency. Also, there is ZERO point trying to increase the resolution of a 7bit message by simply converting it to 14bit midi via something like bomes..
You ever hear of that dude Ean Golden??
Thats still not scratching.
I agree…
I don;t think guys like Qbert…Rafik…etc will use controllers to scratch.
DVS yes…but not a controller.
But you think that because you think that controllers can’t provide that level of performance. And for now you’d be right. But we’re very close to being able to deliver that. Once we have the hardware and software to be able to deliver the kind of performance that would satisfy someone like Qbert, what would stop them?
What would stop them? Umm.. the turntable is their instrument… If it wasn’t why aren’t they using CDJs? That’s about the best I could think of for digital “scratching.” I can see controllers becoming capable of reacting and having the performance to be able to scratch with, the CDJs prove that, it’s just gotta be put to a controller for computers now. The thing is you’re talking about the art form of turntablism. Let me repeat that… Turntablism… How can that possibly be without a turntable?
While digital DJing is getting better and better all the time I really don’t see any true turntablist turning to controllers for their art rather then using the device that is meant for it… That’s like taking a graffiti artist that’s done nothing but use spray paint on walls all his life and replacing all his paint with photoshop and some fancy input controller. While he will still make some great pieces, it’s not true graffiti is it?
Don’t take this as knocking what you’re stating, I do believe that the digital age of “scratch” capable controllers is coming, but to say that true turntablists would convert… Honestly, I highly doubt it. While people such as Grandmaster Flash has converted to Traktor, I don’t think you’ll ever see him using it without two turntables in front of him, do you?
Hedge, I don’t know how well any controller is out there for scratching, but if you want something that’s smaller/lighter then a vinyl turntable for scratching I’d go with a CDJ… While I’ve only used the 800 and the 1000, which are great for scratching, I bet the 400 could be pretty nice if you’re using Traktor which now supports the midi capabilities of the CDJ-400 with the newest version (though still in beta testing right now).
its kinda like comparing painting with photoshop hehe
first off, I just forgot the after my first sentence, sorry.
and to nemonic, I have bomes set to send a 4 to 1 midi ratio on the outside circle of the platter and a 1 to 1 midi ratio on the stripe down the center, as in the scs3d sends 1 message to bomes and bomes sends either 4 or 1 of the same messages to deckadance, so I can scrrub fast or slow with either the left or right finger on the single platter, 4/1 fast control on the circle and 1/1 slow control in the center, and this has not crashed deckadance or ableton at all, the only thing that really does for me, crash abes, is trying to record an entire set within the arrange view, that crashes every time no matter what.
I played 90 min tonight at the little temple bar in LA tonight doing just this, not a glitch from ableton or from deckadance.
*total disclaimer
I rarely, but occasionally, scratch full tracks in deckadance within live, when I have it has been fine, when I use it to scratch samples over the top of my own material it is perfectly responsive for my needs and I love it.
Becasue there are major fundamental differences between a CDJ and a turntable that effect their ability to perform. The platter isn’t motorized, playback isn’t coupled to the platter, the feel is totally different because of the lack of a slipmat, etc.
Your talking about semantics here and not anything else. DJs of all kinds have demonstrated that they’re willing to make the technological jump when the tools match their performance expectations. Look at the adoption curve of DVS. Turntablists weren’t willing to make the jump initially because their performances were compromised by poor performance. That hurdle has been jumped, and now their use is commonplace. DMC embraces them as of last year, and turntablists all over have included them in their performance.
DJ have said the same thing about CDs, and DVS. Both are commonly used technologies now.
If it’s good enough for Kaws, Bansky, and Vhils, it’s probably good enough for anyone else. I think most artists care more about expanding their art than “keeping it real”.
Funny you mention him specifically, since we’ve spoken to him after he expressed an interest in using our controllers. And look at artists like Enferno. You really think if there was a technology that allowed them to perform normally, but greatly expanded their abilities and integrated more tightly into their kit, that they wouldn’t use it? You think once performance is there that establishments won’t opt for fully digital setups, since they both lower booth setup costs while also eliminating things like needle wear, rumble, dirty optics, etc? We already have a generation of DJs who’ve never touched vinyl and aren’t at all romantic about it.
Hand move = Sound Move
Thats the equation for scratching.
It’s too bad the internet didn’t exist back when so we could go back and laugh at all of the comments against scratching in the first place.
“i’m not ruining my records” “noone wants to hear that”
I’ve been using the scs.. and… turntables a lot lately. Playing with one for a while and then the other. i think the word romantic is exactly accurate and is the key here.
There’s a different feel to vinyl. It’s moving, etc. So what we’re really talking about is people being in love with the medium, NOT THE ART.
That’s fine and all, I overstand it, but I don’t agree with it. I’m interested in the art. HAND MOVE = SOUND MOVE, and compared to some of the home-made scratching devices I’ve devised, the SCS puts me in heaven.
I also want to say one last thing…I enjoyed turntables, mixers, and breaks records looooooonnnnng before I had ever heard the names Q-bert, A-trak, MMMike, or many/any others. I wish I could share the e-mail I got from a certain someone from DALy CITy.