First I wish to say hi to all since this is my first post on this forum.
I was looking into buying an USB midi controller / mixer for Traktor and at the moment I haven’t really decided yet but my preference is starting to shift towards the Vestax VCI-100. From what I made up already by reading info on the net this seems an old one compared to some other ones but it still manages to pull ahead of those more recent USB midi controllers. The only one that also comes to mind is the Reloop Digital Jockey 2 but I have a bad gut feeling about it though I can’t actually pinpoint the cause of it.
However, I’m not an expert in digital DJ’ing and I have to rely on communities such as this to enlighten me and learn me a thing or two…uh…million
I have almost no hardware. I use a Creamware Powerpulsar 15DSP audio card + Scope Fusion Platform 4.0, Cubase SL, Creamware Luna 2496 I/O controller, Traktor DJ Studio 3.0 and an Evolution MK-361C midi keyboard / controller.
It should be quite obvious that such a setup, even though it is a small one, is still alot to learn considering I’m just a rooky in creating music and digital DJ’ing. By the way, I’m aware of the fact I should get myself a decent pair of monitors
But anyway, I decided to put more effort in digital DJ’ing since this is actually what interests me the most, though I do understand that the Creamware Powerpulsar 15DSP audio card with Scope Fusion Platform 4.0 is some serious overkill just for the goal of learning to DJ on a computer. I’m not dropping music creation entirely but I need to learn more since the learning curve is quite steep and I have to admitt that having some basic hardware knowledge and expertise is required (for instance on how to connect the different types of plugins like synths, samplers, mixers or effect like reverb, etc)
So, like I mentioned before I created a serious interest in the Vestax VCI-100 and by looking into it more I came across the ‘SE’ version which can only be bought here. When I checked on its current price it means that this ‘SE’-version is about 70 to 90 euro (sorry, dunno what it is in USD) cheaper compared to when I should decide to buy it here in Belgium. I’m wondering how this is possible on a product that has improvements over the original one. And talking about improvements, I read the ‘SE’ one also comes with a new firmware. Does this firmware include 14 bit (or at least 10 bit) support on jogs and faders since a local store advised me to keep that one in mind as standard midi (7 bit) isn’t ideal for beatmatching manually. Hey, I know there is a ‘sync’ button but that doesn’t mean you need to rely on just and only that. So I wonder how valid this advise is and how some of you think about it or have some experience with it and wish to share their thoughts on it.
When I should’ve decided to buy the VCI-100 SE I will ofcourse upgrade Traktor DJ Studio 3.0 to Traktor Pro
Thanks in advance for any info you could give me on all of this.
Don’t be flooded by all the supposed greatness of the VCI-100 around here, all the people using it are just following Ean’s steps like sheeps, they are MIDI-nerds that love to spend their time doing mappings and installing firmware rather than djing which is what is all about, think for yourself, if you are a beginner the Reloop is a lot better cause it comes pre-mapped for Traktor pro and is made for playing with it, so it has lots of functions that the VCI lacks and you’ll have to blow your mind and spend countless hours to configure and set to manage the VCI to do the same that the reloop does already by factory. The Reloop is also cheaper and it doesn’t looks bad, what’s your problem with it? What do you want to learn? Djing or MIDI headache?
I think you’d have a lot of fun with the VCI mate. Its been around a while but a lot of guys around here use it for good reason, and there’s heaps of support and help available from these fellas. Its a good alround, rock solid device that does the job. You can start off with just the basics and move up to controllerism etc when you get comfortable with it. You can also incorporate your midi keyboard into the setup no worries. welcome to djtt btw
regardless of how you feel about the vci, or the site, I’d say that “hours” is a bit on the extreme side. I installed Eans mappings, made tweaks to it, and started jamming out in about 15 minutes (would have been about 3 without the rewerks). The only extra functionality the reloop might have is the fact that it has 2 separate knob sections for effects, which means no cycling via vci (although this problem is solved by both fader fx mode, and eq effects, which you will not have access to with the reloop unless you spend hours and possibly days bogged in the mappings). However, now that traktor has 4 fx banks, this still doesn’t fit the bill.
While I’m sure the reloop is a nice device, the reason why I grew wool, and started baa’ing, is because of the amazing support group here on this forum. If you are having any type of issue with your vci, the sheer number of people willing to help you is tremendous, and the mappings available are quite indepth, well thought out, and frequently updated.
Also, how can you tell him to think for himself, and then hand him your advice to take?
But to be honest, dont expect to be told much else than vci 100 on this site. I mean, we are all sheep, that’s how we do. I’m just a midi nerd… cant dj worth anything (actually, that part has some actual truth to it haha), and regularly spend 6-8 hours revamping my mappings, just so I can pause and play a song and use the eq’s…
Ean has made so much effort & improvment to this particular controller with performances to prove it! With so much information, after sales service and general know how on the history and prosperous future ahead for this device I’d go where there is know and choose the VCI-100! If that makes me a sheep…So be it, peace of mind is never a bad thing, I believe!
It has obviously withstood the test of vigorous gigging and bashing of cue buttons too as you stated NZ, She’s a tough bitch with a 6 ft Strap-On! Not exactly what you said but same difference!
Lol! I don’t actually use one myself, have a Hercules, I-Mix and a few other toys to play with, but woulda grabbed the VCI had i knwn about it back then. BTW names jester bro
Well, that was already alot to read and it’s quite clear nothing is black nor white. Everyone seems to have their own opinions and it doesn’t make it easyer to choose.
One of the reasons I’m so reluctant of the Reloop Digital Jockey 2 is the fact I would only buy the controller edition (the one without sound interface and I will explain why soon) and it seems that it isn’t equipped with touch sensitive jogs which surprises me alot if you take into consideration that this is a very recent controller and what astonishes me even more is the fact the interface edition does have that feature (although I read some reviews on it where they aren’t too happy with it - this was tested with firmware 1.8 so it could have been resolved already though I can’t find a review on firmware 1.9 for that controller)
Now, I promissed to tell why in hell I would choose for a controller without sound interface. I own a Creamware Powerpulsar 15DSP audio card and by the looks of it I will have a second one soon (lol, even more overkill but 300 euro or 428,79 USD for such a card is just a bargain).
However, in the past I used my computer for both digital music as for any other activities like chatting, gaming, etc. So the computer was also equipped with a more suitable soundcard for gaming (EAX), namely the SoundBlaster Audigy! When I decided to keep myself occupied with digital music I went to device manager and disabled that SoundBlaster Audigy. When I then booted Scope Fusion Platform or when I was routing in it, it occured several times the whole package just froze or decided to close to the desktop. At a certain moment we decided to get rid of that SoundBlaster Audigy and just stick to the Creamware Powerpulsar card with SFP 4.0 and I never encountered that same problem again.
What I wish to say with all of this is that I don’t question Reloop’s audio interface but I do question why I should buy something which could prove to be a problem and I don’t intend to use in the first place anyway hence why I would not hesitate a minute to buy the Denon HC4500 if I didn’t had a good audio card (and maybe two soon)!
Now, all of this is getting us a bit off track. All I wished to know was if the VCI-100 would do the job, why it is so cheap compared to the original Vestax version without the improvements and is 7bit midi indeed the weak spot of the device and should it prove to be a problem for someone who will work with just as few hardware as possible (except I still need darn good monitors for around 450 USD but still need to convince my better half first…hehe)
Here in AUS the VCI-100 is around $800 AUD at best!
I can pay for shipping and do the conversion to USD through DJTT and STILL have $100+ to spare with a better controller than what I would be paying $800 for!
That’s all I can really contribute into this thread!
Well, I’m still looking into it more by looking at Youtube video’s on the different controllers and also on nanopads as DeeEss suggested and I have to say that the Reloop Digital Jockey 2 - Controller Edition starts to make sense as obvious choice for Traktor Pro.
What is the true benefit of having touch sensitive jog wheels since the Reloop Digital Jockey 2 - Controller Edition doesn’t have this feature but still is able to scratch after pressing the ‘scratch’ button on its panel while my guess is that the VCI-100 SE does this automatically when it feels a ‘touch’ on its jogs…or am I completely wrong in this?
And what do nanopads exacly do? Cue parts of songs, add beat-patterns? I’m still not aware of their actual function.
There’s Ean on a nanopad. basically, he is “juggling” between spots in the songs (cue points) and effecting it. You can achieve something similar with the bottom buttons on the vci (not as responsive, but if you do the arcade mod, it easily is if not more).
as far as having the scratch button, i believe that just changes between scratch and cdj mode, as in, in cdj mode, when you spin the jog, it speeds or slows up the song. In scratch mode, if it detects motion on the jog, it will stop the song, and start draggin it at the speed of the encoder. This means it will only be paused during motion.
dont be discouraged. i started out with serato itch and have just abandoned it for ableton. it all depends on what kind of workflow you want and what type of sound you are going for. the vci is a great piece of hardware from what ive seen, and no, i dont own one nor do i plan on owning one. this is all from stuff ive seen online and on this site.
traktor seems pretty adaptable. has great fx and good midi mapping capabilities. had i not been caught up in the serato itch hype back when i decided to start djing, i would have definitely started with the vci.
i would say spend some time on youtube and look at videos of people using the different controllers/software you are interested in. good luck!
We’re certainly not getting discouraged. It’s actually getting more confusing when I get to see them both in active setups on youtube
By the way, are Korg and Akai the only pad controller developers out there? If I type ‘pad controller’ in either youtube.com or google I only get results from those two brands.
I am under the impression that Touch Sensitive is a good feature because when you go to scratch, i.e. press the scratch button, when you place your hand on the jog wheel it detects that contact and sends a midi message to the software which is used as a command! For example STOP playback when you touch, START playback when you release! Just like when you hold a record and let the platter free spin! So my view is it’s a REALLY good feature because when scratching you don’t have to create a slight constant motion in order to keep the playback where you want it, i.e. at the start of a bass drum sample!
Get my drift? I think I’m right, don’t quote me on it!
As for the Pad Controllers, Akai, Korg, M-Audio also make one and maybe a few others, check out www.djwarehouse.com.au may have some more u havn’t seen!
I personally bought the Korg PadKontrol with the 16 pads, 2 assignable knobs and an xy touch pad! After owning one for a while using it in garageband, ableton and now traktor. I recommend getting a Pad Controller with more knobs or sliders and not just an xy pad with a couple of knobs!
If I could swap for another Pad Controller it would be the M-Audio trigger finger! Though I’m not sure if it has the dual port capabilities korg does which allows me to have to midi in ports and ultimatley use two programs at once on the same scene set!
Damn, that card is 20x20… you weren’t kidding about it being overkill were you
I say vci-100. The thing about midi mapping taking forever is a stark lie, I designed my own mapping with full functionality within two hours of taking the packaging off. I’ve since tried out the djtt tsi, been disappointed, reverse engineered the 3.0 tsi, also been disappointed, and remapped it countless times and found plenty of time to test each remap out on a gig.
Also, having a touch sensitive wheel is a big plus. You do not want to be pressing a scratch button when your natural instinct is just to grab the jog wheel.
It’s not just that we’re fanboys… the vci-100 is a damned solid piece of kit that can be chucked around. Imho the vci-100 + masking tape strips + sharpie + custom mapping combo can’t be beat. Look at the reloop digital jockey. What if you don’t want the play button on the right, you want it on the left? You’re kinda stuck with it.
Don’t worry about the lack of high-res midi, chances are you’ll be using sync most of the time. Plus, it’s not that difficult to get close to the right tempo with just 128 steps, I do back to back sets with a friend of mine sometimes and I don’t have any difficulty using the pitch faders and nudging the platter along to keep in sync.
Finally, you’re right about not wanting to buy something with a built in sound card… they almost always have buggy drivers and just don’t work as well as a dedicated interface.
oh and p.s. good luck finding darn good monitors for less than $450 usd - studio monitors are an expensive endeavor if you care about the sound they’re putting out. just a tip
Yup, you hit the nail on the head there. It will become a case of carefully taking all of the pro and contra’s into consideration and somehow I do find it weird to put ‘scratch’ mode on before you can even do a scratch while the VCI-100 just does it automatically when you pull the jog back…er…I assume because when I look at its layout I also notice a button called ‘scratch’…er, oh my god…
However, DeeEss’ point about letting a track stop as soon as you hit the jog seems more interesting. Don’t get me wrong, I do think scratching should always be an option but I will be focussing on trance, hardtrance (hardstyles in general) and it doesn’t happen that often with those styles if you compare this with urban music for instance but the feature to have the deck stop as soon you hit its jog, seems something which will occure countless times more then actual scratching
Going to look into the pad controller from M-audio
I had to send my GF away when I came to that part of your reply. I just told her: “Don’t worry dear, I got it covered…he was just joking…I wasn’t going to spend both of our 13th month paychecks on this…uhum” Thanks!
By the way, all of this is alot and I can joke around as much as I want to, it doesn’t mean all of this will happen just overnight. I want to take it serious and just giving in to the desire to have a shopping spree is not what I wish for. I ask all of this to get me informed as best as I can and then use the feedback I get in a way so I can connect it with my own way of learning how to be a digital DJ.
I’m really thankfull that communities such as this exist. Already a huge ‘thank you’ from me to those who added their two cent.
The scratch button on the vci-100 toggles which midi cc the jog wheel sends out… sounds complicated, but basically you could set it up so when it’s lit, it acts like vinyl, and when it’s not lit, you can scroll/seek through the track at high speed.
Really it’s not about scratching, it’s about finding the downbeat or doing backspins. But believe me, they’re damned nice things to have. I started off with a bcf2k and a trigger finger, went to timecoded vinyl, and am now firmly in the vci-100 camp, which ironically is actually the first bit of kit I really wanted, I just cut corners and now have loads of unused gear lying around.
Usually the way you set up the midi to scratch with a vci-100 is like this → scratch on when you touch the platter, and the actual scratch to the rotation of the platter. That way you can also set up the side of the platter to nudge the tempo.
Rokits are very popular with djs, they sound like a little baby pa system. The problem with that of course is that the mids are scooped pretty deep, whereas with studio monitors you want as much clarity as possible in that range. For djing, yes, for studio work, ehhhhh you can get by with them but meh. Maybe look into a pair of mackie mr8s, I own a pair and am fairly pleased with them for being a low end monitor. Ultimate solution of course is to head to a guitar center with some cds and listen to as many pairs as possible.
