Hey everybody!
I just got into production and mainly use Ableton Live for music production at the moment. As I think hardware would be much more comfortable than mouse and keyboard for editing parameters, volume etc. I was looking for a mixer which is MIDI-capable (or capable of another protocoll which communicates with Ableton).
I just had a look at the Mackie Control Universal Pro which is already quite fine (motorfaders, transport section etc.), but I would love to have some more encoders for having to use “Shift”-Switches less. Nicest would be a controller that looks almost like an analog mixer with several rows of encoders.
But as far as I’ve not yet found one I would like to hear your suggestions!
(P.S.: I’m not talking about such a 50.000$ Protools mixer, budget is probably not much higher than 2000 if really necessary.)
Nothing wrong with producing with a mouse. It’s the only way I do it. A better way to speed up what your doing is to learn all the key shortcuts in Live.
Already thought about it and despite of lots of criticism on the internet it seesm quite great, but as far as I know, it’s no longer built and with second-hand gear it’s often a question in which condition it arrives. But I will keep in mind!
Very good recommendation and I would directly jump into it, maybe with an additional launchpad, if it had motor faders. It’s a pity it doesn’t…
I’ll keep learning keyboard shortcuts, that’s a good tip, but my experiences with other music gear (S4, Maschine etc.) is that they enhance the workflow a lot!
get the APC40. you have access to faders for all channels, and practically speaking, unlimited encoders to use. the device control section will control whichever effect or effect rack (and macro bank) you currently have selected, so you can hop between devices and always be controlling whichever parameters you need.
if you need a shit ton of encoders and that’s all you need, consider a BCR2000
+1 on the APC 40, I was set on the VCM for ages until I found out that the controls are all knobs and not encoders (FUCK!) APC pretty much nails everything (for now)
However I’m thinking that a few K2’s and/or Behringer CMD’s once they all get released would be a wicked setup for live and give even more hands on control to all the parameters rather than needing to switch banks all the time or compromise on channel EQ’s.
If its really motor faders you want you could go the ol’ BCF2000 route mind you, cheap as chips and reliable.
For production in Live, you’ll be drawing in automation using the mouse. If you’re adjusting things (volume, EQ, etc…) using a midi controller none of that will be recorded and will disappear when you click “Back to Arrangement”…
You’re wrong man! You can record controller automations. Just check out the tuts on Youtube! And to me it’s much more easy and especially quicklier to automate it once or twice with hands on a real controller than keep tweeking the automation line for minutes using the mouse.
@ajrindy & deevey
Already considered the APC 40 for myself and you’re absolutely right. In most aspects and especially for live usage the APC 40 is the hottest controller on the market. Though for production, when you are sitting in front of an arrangement with for example 30 tracks and there are no motorfaders, and you have to keep pressing shift buttons etc. to get the right EQ Channel and parameters it takes a lot of the fun.
Nevertheless, to be realistic, APC 40 seems to be one of the best solutions.
Wish the K2s had only endless encoders, then switching layers would be a bit more easy (no need for collect-mode with danger to turn the knob to far…)
BTW: Don’t like Behringer products so much… . Maybe it’s simply because of the ugly blue
I know, it’s quite difficult if not impossible to find exactly what I’m looking for, especially to have everything in one device.
Nevertheless: Maybe one of you will find exactly something like that…
Thanks for your recommendations so far!
Why are motorized faders so important, just wondering.
You can change the takeover mode in ableton to make the faders worked when jumping between different channels. or whatever it’s called in Ableton. I jsut always refer to it as “soft take-over” mode from when I used my APC40 with traktor
Its horrible to use,for fast switching of channels its not accurate and not very productive when you need to watch everything on screen to make sure you aren’t screwing up.
Its uncomfortable to use in production at best and not a hope in hell I could use soft takeover in a live situation either, I know others do it, but its a personal thing I guess. I need a knob/fader/button assigned to every task individually unless they are encoders or motorized.
I am! This are quite the best recommendations so far. You’re one of the first people understanding my probs, I guess. Great! White Behringer devices and the Zero 8 are currently unavailable in German stores but maybe I will think of importing. But with customs duty and shipping costs can rocket high.
Qcon or Alesis Master Control are quite nice but still without more encoders.
But quite love your idea of using Mackie + livid Code! That would be pretty much it. In contrast to the other devices I never got to know from the Livid Code, but now with the knowledge about it things seem to look much easier! (It’s a shame the Mackie C4 is no longer sold…) Great recommendation!
Btw: the case for these two Behringer devices: Is it DIY or commercially available?
OK so not motorized faders BUT 24 of them which would be enough for “most” projects, and a good few buttons to play, its a decent enough all metal chassis.
Also from what I can of the manual you can program lighting chases and run it like an automated step sequencer, always wanted to try it out but current location unfortunately prevents me getting one to test.
You can download the manual on their site and check how midi is assigned, I remember looking at it before and saw possibilities ..
Paired with a Code it could be very interesting.
The case for the BCR is DIY btw - sad to say, the side panels come off pretty easy though and you could bolt 2 units together at the bottom (like the APC80) and put nice wooden edges on them easy enough
Just had a look at it and found a review where was said, that unfortunately only a few (think they said 8) faders are really Midi-capable. Though I don’t know if this is truely right…
The manual is available HERE and its got a full midi list on page 23 with the CC values and assignments for midi suggesting that pretty much everything is mappable.
In the mean-time I have started thinking about buying some Behringer BCF/BCR stuff and repainting it. That would save up money for production stuff like new monitor headphones, two new soft-synth and more. Maybe I’ll give it a try soon. Quite busy at the moment
, budget is probably not much higher than 2000 if really necessary.)
a BCR and one or 2 BCR’s though would give you more control if you have the space.
