I have been djing for about a couple of weeks now with a mixtrack pro and traktor le and am slowly getting to grips with things. So far i can beatmatch quite well when i first use the BPM counters to make sure the BPMs of the tracks are as matched as possible (i have been practising not using BPM counters every now and then but not very successfully), from then I beat match by ear and never use the sync button, however i still feel i am ‘cheating’. Obviously i want to eventually mix in clubs or bars where i understand CDJs are the norm, my questions are do all cdjs have a bpm counter on them? And do you recommend putting the effort in to learning to beatmatch properly now or to just get better at other techniques first and worry about that later?
Learn to beatmatch manually and it will serve you well whatever equipment you are using and whatever track you are playing, the BPM is only a guide and can, and is frequently incorrect.
CDJ’s (at least the last ones I used) only display whole numbers as BPM (where traktor displays .00).
It’d be worthwhile renting a pair out for a weekend and getting a feel for them.
Something to also note, some of the BPM counters can be “fooled” by music that doesn’t follow normal beats. Mixing drum and bass will often show either 170 or 85, both are technically correct but will be confusing if only mixing via the counters.
Agree… learn by ear first. Even when people Sync there are times depending on the beat-gridding or lack thereof within the software being used that will make it necessary to nudge the track manually to correct.
Using BPM is also dependent on the accuracy of the BPM counter. For instance, my old DJM-500 has no where near the accuracy of today’s mixers, nor do my CDJ-200’s. My Xone DX with Itch BPM counters a far more accurate and make mixing so much simpler.
Mixing by ear with both beat and pitch is a quality skill to have.
Ok thanks guys i will get learning. I have a few mates with cdjs so will have to have a go on them. Another question, if i learn to beatmatch house music (as i have been told to do by various tutorials) will i then be able to beatmatch dubstep (the old style sub bassy 2-step type shizz), which is the genre i primarily want to mix? Or should i just learn to beatmatch dubstep from the off?
If you learn house then it should flow to other styles as well. For example, if you got the basic house beat down, you can picture the constant beat in dub-step or drum and bass, even if it’s not there. This is especially helpful for timing when the song breaks down and knowing when it’s going to stop.
An idea that helped me was using a beat counter and just trying to keep a constant number while listening to the song. So when you have a house song, it’s a simple beat 0—0—0—0, but with say dub step, it may be 00–00–000-0—, you still keep the same tapping on the counter. Once you understand the tempo, you can beat mix any other song.
DJ’s (well the better ones IMO) would all BPM their records before hand anyways. So I don’t see what the big deal is now about BPM’ing tracks.
I’m not saying you should have a BPM counter running while you are trying to beat match, but you should know ahead of time the BPM of the tracks you are trying to mix. Which will give you a general idea of where you need to set the pitch fader.
With some of the beat grid and BPM detection issues within Traktor, it will benefit you greatly to learn to beat match by ear. Very often songs detected at the same BPM will drift apart.
Let’s put it this way, when your CDJs go down, and you have to resort to playing off of the crate of vinyl with your set on it, you’re going to have to tempo match by ear. So if the thought of getting stranded with nothing but a box of self-pressed records scares you, you should learn to not rely on a basic piece of technology that’s been universal since about 2003.
for sheer respect of the scene and the craft you should learn to beat match by ear, but forget weeks, it will take months to learn!!! yes all cdjs have bpm readouts, but they cant be 100% trusted. and yes if uve beat gridded ur tracks in traktor that will be accurate as fuck with the phase meter etc, but if u never learn to beat match by ear and rely on visual aids, then i’ll cast u under the same shroud as all the other fucking wannabies out there.
As the previous two posters have mentioned, beat-matching is a skill that requires practice. It was essentially a life skill of any DJ - much like reading a crowd or volume control or knowing your tracks - prior to the emergence of accurate BPM counters. And while BPM counters prior to the software versions are not to be fully trusted, they did an outstanding job of putting a DJ in the right ball-park for pitch. It should be mentioned that some CDJ have BPM’s to the tenth now, so the accuracy eliminates some of the extra error margin (CDJ-350 for example).
The Sync button simply allowed DJ’s used to beat-matching to be able to be much more creative without having to spend the amount of time needed to cue up manaully and beat-match by ear that was necessary to craft their sound. It also allowed for DJ’s to mix any number of decks together with less fear of things going all wrong mid-mix. And while it seems like completely cheating, there still is a margin of error within some programs as I mentioned prior (such as Itch).
What kills me is seeing these mixes out now where tracks have clearly been cue’d and synced, but it is clear that some nudging is needed to fine tune the alignment. The trained ear needs to recognize those pitch needs. This goes for EQ’ing as well.
You will be doing yourself a great service forcing yourself not to use the Sync button UNTIL you have felt that you have mastered the art of beat-matching, whether you plan to be a professional or amateur.
Best of luck!
Yeah this is what i thought, i can’t help but feel i’m cheating everytime i use the bpm counter/ phase meter, i would never dare perform in a club without at least having the skill of manual beatmatching. I feel it would be disrespectful to my vinyl spinning friends.
Meh. Beatmatching is a dying skill. We’ve had hundreds of threads on this so I wont go into major detail, just give the major points:
Beatmatching by ear is the norm for Vinyl and CDJ.
Beatmatching by ear is no longer the norm for controllers.
With more and more people moving to controllers, less people are beatmatching by ear.
With things like beatgridding, less people feel the need to learn to beatmatch by ear.
In my opinion if you can’t beatmatch you’re not a bad DJ or a fake, just a new breed. I remember spending days at a set just trying to beatmatch properly. That just isn’t required with today’s technology.
So hey, if you feel like learning to beatmatch, more power to you. If not, screw it, who cares?
Beatmatching isn’t a dying skill. If you don’t beatgrid your tracks, you can’t properly use sync. If your bpm counter is off, your mix will sound off. If you want to DJ, and want to be serious about it, learn how to beatmatch. When things go wrong, and they will, you will be happy you put the effort into learning.
Part of the problem with the technological revolution that’s going on right now, in DJing, and the world, is that we are becoming far too reliant on electronics. If your microwave breaks, can you cook all of your food in the oven? Handwriting is being taken out of schools and is being replaced by keyboard skills. A great thing to know, but what happens in 2 or 3 generations when something crashes and nobody knows how to write? Another dark age.
We (as a society) are becoming lazy in many aspects of life because technology makes things easy. If that technology isn’t there one day, or stops working, do you have something to fall back on?
Mixing by ear isn’t about being “better”, its about adapting and being able to switch out of your normal routine when that routine fails.
I can’t tell if you’re just acting daft or if you’re actually an idiot.
Your argument is that if we come across another dark age, we’ll need to know how to beatmatch by ear?
I agree it’s a useful skill, I disagree that it’s needed. People just beatgrid these days. It’s easier to just need a few nudges then to beatmatch every song.
Keep the name calling down bro, its not necessary.
The point I was trying to make is that we rely too much on technology to do things for us that we can do naturally. The dark ages point was obviously (you missed it) a gross exaggeration. I don’t expect for technology to all fail, but that just re-enforces my point, we don’t expect it to. You tune your laptop right out so that it runs at full peak, but it still crashes, and you get angry because you didn’t expect it.
Learn to beatmatch by ear if your not lazy, or take the beatgrid/sync route if you want to as well. Or better yet, learn both. What does it hurt? What happens when you know traktor inside and out, can use beatgrids and the bpm counter, and then go to a friends house and use serato? You can’t match by ear, so you have to rely on those little hash marks.
If YOU don’t want to match by ear, I don’t care, doesn’t affect my mixing. Just making a comment, don’t like it, don’t read it.
I think it’s important but if the software can do it, and you know how to set it up correctly, why bother with beat matching.
This is sort of like the old days of computers, 30 years ago it took a computer science degree just to use a computer, now the technical stuff is all done behind the scenes so that anyone can use it. Yes, you can get technical and dig into the guts of the computer, program your own scripts, but why should you when it works just as well without.
For some people, they want total control and understanding how to beat match without any external help is going to off the most control, much like the technical computer user wants to control their OS.
My only concern is if you need a tool or feature to mix, what do you do when you’re working on a different system?