I know this has prob already been brought up before but do any other old school dj’s miss the days when you didn’t need a computer or CD to DJ???.. DJin has evolved so much that a lot of the skill of mixing has been replaced by programs that automatically mix, beat-match, and DJ for you…
I blew the dust off a crate of mine and Dj’d a nice set without BPM on two turntables NO computer and just thought…DAMN… Dj’in is too complicated these days… you never had to UPGRADE your computer or buy multiple program updates to be a DJ. Going to the record store was something you looked forward to weekly…now, all you have to do is buy a laptop and push buttons… nothing against Digital DJ’s like ean who have a unique style but most people are not that creative with their mix…especially if they never spun on vinyl…
idk, just a thought, i’m up for a laptop upgrade and would much rather spend $1000 on records then a computer i’ll have to upgrade/replace in a few years… i remember when you had to buy a kaos pad to use effects…damn that was a good minute ago…aw well, times have changed
unless you’re like me, I dont do a full shutdown of my laptop, I have it hibernate so when I power it on it boots up in like 10-15 seconds, will be FAR faster when I get a SSD into it.
I’m just saying…djing wasn’t complicated back in the day u only had to worry about two things, power going out or ur needle possibly skipping but u didn’t have to have a laptop, a backup laptop and all the technology to wow a crowd…just needed a good ear for music and to be able to read the crowd
I remember when serato first came out, I worked @GC back in 2005… its only been 6 years and look where we are now…online dmc championships where you can cue up all your scratches and set without skill at all…yes scratching is a skill but so is cueing up a record and scratching without the needle skipping…
The only plus to the dvs systems is not having to carry those heavy ass crates of records to every gig
that sounds dangerously like the old “sync” or “not to sync” argument yet again… the skills have just changed thats all.
do i miss my old 1200’s and intimidation blue mixer with it’s pretty blue lights? sure… and would i like to mix that way again one day maybe sometimes? sure also…
but i’d never swap all the potential of my midi controllers and integration of live sets that before i could only do in my old studio for just the pair of 1200’s and mixer
plugging a midi controller and the audio out from a laptop into an amp to have a mix can’t be more hassle than messing round with all the old audio cables anyway…
i’m sure i’ll have a pair of decks again one day tho as well as my midi stuff. i’ve never tried a DVS but i suppose with that you have the hassles of setting up decks combined with laptop/software etc. i’d like to try a DVS but i suspect i’d rather either mix with midi controllers or just use real vinyl on a turntable.
How many times will this discussion arise? Whenever a new technology comes around, a group of people will decry it. It has happened with everything from microwave ovens, to CDJ players, to computers. The OP claims that everything used to be better, how DJing “used to take skill” and how DJs these days “just press the sync button”. Arguments we’ve all heard before, and that, ultimately, have proven to be unfounded.
Same… I often have the urge to mix the old fashioned way but I know I made the switch to digital because it allows me to do more. I don’t think I’d ever switch my main setup back from digital, but it would be fun to play with every once in a while.
And, like the OP, of course I have some bitterness about the accessibility of things nowadays, where anyone can get a cracked copy of VDJ and be able to mix without a colossal trainwreck of double-beating within minutes. There’s nothing inherently wrong with digital DJing, its just that the lower startup investment (time, money, and effort) brings in a lot more people that don’t really care about what they’re doing. All in all its a small price to be paid for all the great things that the digital realm has offered.
i love posts like this it seems like the op is struggling to find creativity, back in the day what he thinks was creativity was mixing 2 songs on 2 turntables, the reason this stood out back then was because a good set of tts cost good money, these days people crack software and everyone has access to the same music. So how do we stand out? Well it takes a lot more work, we can do our own edits or dig the depths of the internet for producers unknown to man or even do ean golden style stuff but technically youd be copying him then? So in theory these days anyone can mix but not everyone knows how to be different, i suggest if you want to stand out, take your laptop to a tribe in the african plains and play for them, you may find it hard to find a socket along with them calling you a witch but you’ll deff stand out
[quote]DJin has evolved so much that a lot of the skill of mixing has been replaced by programs that automatically mix, beat-match, and DJ for you…
I blew the dust off a crate of mine and Dj’d a nice set without BPM on two turntables NO computer and just thought…DAMN…[/quote]
I can relate. I held out on going digital for a very long time - just made the transition about a year and a half ago. I still love playing and listening to vinyl sets. There is something pure about the whole experience. It’s like the difference between getting an email and getting a hand written letter. The letter might be a little harder to read with someone’s sloppy handwriting but you know they wrote it by hand, carried it to a post box and probably put a lot more thought into it.
On the other hand there’s no program out there that DJ’s for you. Sure sync and search are game changers, personally i think the second more than the first but I am coming from a club perspective not really a turntableist. I mean anyone who played vinyl a few years could pretty much beat match in their sleep unless there was some monitoring/sound issue at the club. But being able to search and carry 2k+ tunes - absolute game changer.
The thing is you still have to know what song to play next. No software is going to pick the track for you and with that much material it is almost harder now than it ever was when you just dug through your crate. And while sync and cue points def get the track playing easier and faster than a tone arm, you still have to get the phrasing right, know when to kick the bass over, know when to pull a track out of the mix without losing energy, and generally how to construct a diverse set of music that flows and keeps people live.
Cost of my digital audio collection if it were records bought new at any point since I started Djing: >$6000
Cost of my Current DJ/Production Setup:
Macbook Pro: $1400
Mercury Extreme Pro SSD 6G: $400
Audio 2: $100
Pair of X1s: $400
Traktor Pro 2 upgrade from LE: $140
DJing Music in Digital Formats: $~1400
Used Xone:62: $425
KRK RP5s: $400
And just for good measure:
Logic Express 9: $200
Maschine: $600
Random Accessories: $150
Furniture: $150
Total for Digital DJin and Production including music: $4665
The vinyl setup I would spin with if purchased today:
3x 1210 m5g: $4000
3x Shure Whitelabel: $270
Rane Empath Rotary: $1000
Total: $5270 + $6000 in music makes $11,270
That’s a lot of money for keeping it real and not being able to produce.
Want to look at just the production side?
Current:
Macbook Pro: $1400
Mercury Extreme Pro SSD 6G: $400
Logic Express 9: $200
Maschine: $600
Random Accessories: $150
Furniture: $150
Total: $2900
Hardware Version with similar capabilities:
Electron Octatrack: $1400
Electron Monomachine: $1400
MPC 500: $500
Access Virus TI2 Desktop: $1800
Acidlab Bombass: $750
Acidlab Miami: $1250
Korg D3200: $1300
Total: $8400
And technically, that doesn’t even include a keyboard because I don’t know which one I’d buy if I had it to do over again.
I started on Vinyl.
There’s a reason everything I do is on the computer. Namely, it’s the extra fifteen grand or so that I’d have to spend to do everything I now do in hardware.
Fifteen grand buys a lot of strippers and cookies.
One of these days I’m going to buy a netbook and build a linux installation that does nothing other than load my DVS.
Hopefully I should be able to plug in my sound card, press the power button and it’ll be ready before I’ve turned on the mixer and put the vinyl on the decks.
I can relate exactly to these two quotes… I’ve seen so much change over the last 15 years behind the decks: Everything from old Bozak and Urei mixers being replaced with Rane and then Pioneer… to CDJs becoming the ‘standard’ and on to DVS and now the controller movement. Change has been inevitable.
At one point I realized it wasn’t wise to resist the changes as each brought about new possibilities. That being said, what eeks me to no end is newcomers to our craft that dismiss the value inherent in ‘old’ tools and techniques. Perhaps the most significant result of these dismissals is that many contemporary DJs lack a sense of voyage or story line within their sets. Instead, these sets seem to be a competition on how many tracks they can mix into a given time frame regardless of any sense of musicality.
More is not always better. Sometimes less is more. Just because it is possible and much easier these days to select, cue, sync, and mix a tune - doesn’t mean that one shouldn’t let a song play through its parts. I can’t count the number of times I’ve thought.. ‘hey, that’s a kick-ass track’ only to have it yanked away after 30 seconds (or less) and another jammed down my throat. The limitations of the past often necessitated longer song plays which in turn allowed audiences to feel the music, not just physically through frequency interaction with their bodies, but emotionally / mentally.
The tools of our trade are just the means be which we entertain. There is just as much value in mixing traditional vinyl as there is in mixing via controllers, and there are lessons that newcomers and old-timers alike can learn from each other if they choose to do so. The difference between great sets and mediocre sets comes down to talent. Talent to curate the music; talent to read the crowd and respond in kind; and talent to lead them into places they aren’t familiar with and have them enjoy it!
It has gotten complicated but it has also changed. DJing today is not what DJing was and I think that’s for the better. No longer do I have to pray the new imports I want didn’t get scooped up by either the shop owner or the shop owners buds. Now if I want to add routines and chop songs up I can without getting out a Reel to Reel and an Exacto knife or buying multiple copies of the same record-although I still do this one from time to time
It has changed and there are great things about both. But I love the amount of availability these changes has made. Yes anyone with a halfway decent laptop and 200$ can become a DJ but it takes a lot more than that to become a good DJ.
The record store experience. Beatport, Juno and iTunes just don’t compare to my favourite places from back in the day.
Not having to take a badly marked, iffy mixing deck wiring apart to hook up your soundcard. Arrive, open record bag, play vinyl, done.
Oldschool no-frills but great sounding Urei and Rane mixers instead of crappy sounding DJM500s wherever you go.
Things I don’t miss:
Carrying three record bags, which are reeeaaly heavy.
Buying crazy expensive rare imports for the B side and having to buy the useless A side as well
The bigger name DJs playing out all the great tunes on dubplate until people really get tired of them, and the necessity of kissing more important people’s asses to get the tunes before that point.
