My Nightmares w/ Traktor.

[Tenova]

My Nightmares w/ Traktor.

Hey everyone,

So I’m posting this to let you all know about the issues I’ve had with Traktor. I’m not asking for help, but I feel like you all need to know about the absolute nightmares I’ve dealt with in this software.

A little background, I have three DJ residencies at the most prominent EDM clubs in Pittsburgh. I’ve opened for countless headliners (Bingo Players, Laidback Luke, GTA, Kill The Noise, etc.), played Life in Color in my home city this year, and basically spend all day, every day learning about DJ’ing.

Before you all ask, I’ve ran stable copies of OSX that had no issues with Traktor during the time of each of these issues. I also kept Traktor as up to date as possible the entire time as well. I travel with all of my gear in flight cases, keep dust out of it and have my laptop protected as well.

So, I play out every single weekend, with at least 10 hours of play time from Thursday through Saturday. That being said, I’ve had almost every issue imaginable with Traktor and the S4 system. I’d like to list them so you’re all aware of what you’re getting into before you purchase one of these things:

1. Complete loss of my entire library, playlists, etc. I opened Traktor one day, while having installed absolutely nothing new on my computer from the night before, and it took me through a setup menu you get when you first install. I thought it was odd, but I went along with it. I now use OSX to organize my files. When it was completed, it had erased all of my playlists. You might ask yourself, “why not use History and get it all back?”

That brings me to my next problem.

2. Months and months of no history being kept whatsoever. I called Native Instruments and they had no solution to this problem. Months of playlists, gone forever.

3. Extreme lag effecting audio consistency and causing short dropouts when I don’t restart my computer literally every single time before I play out on it. I know this is standard procedure, but I have an $1800 Macbook Pro that I bought new three months ago, and it still has this issue. There will be times when I’ve been rushed to get on stage and start playing, didn’t restart, and this has ruined sets for me.

4. The entire S4 unit losing functionality, jog wheels not working, and all buttons going completely haywire and not controlling the software entirely. This one boggles my mind still. My S4 worked fine the day prior, when I went to hook it up and practice, it had completely shit itself overnight. Nothing worked. I was under warranty, and it was replaced. It did, however, take weeks for this to happen. I lost a few gigs during this period.

5. RANDOM CRASHES. Traktor WILL, every once in a while, just completely quit itself and an OSX error message will pop up. This has happened numerous times, however, never while DJ’ing. The most recent time when it did this, I had finished a gig 5 minutes prior, and Traktor sent OSX into Kernel Panic, one of the rarest issues to have on a MacBook Pro where the entire operating system is forced to restart for no apparent reason.

…and now, for my current issue.

6. Complete loss of audio/connectivity between laptop and controller while DJ’ing. This is one that I’ve been dealing with for a while now. This has happened to me twice while DJ’ing live. All of my channels in Traktor will, all of the sudden, start crackling and hissing, make a horrible screeching sound, and stop my music entirely. I’ve gone through two different MacBook logic boards as well as a clean install when trying to sort this issue out, and it works for about a month before it begins again.

It’s become apparent that it’s not the fault of the computer, but of Traktor. I’ve checked my System Diagnostics and it seems as if CoreAudio is crashing, and takes Traktor down with it. I currently have a ticket in with Native Instruments on this one, just sent them a diagnostic and am waiting to hear back.

[TL/DR]: All of these issues can happen to you. I have a very standard, run of the mill DJ setup. Traktor is great software, but these issues are completely ridiculous. Had I known that any of these issues were to arise, I would have never invested time in this software.

[shr3dder]

@Tenova

1. Complete loss of my entire library, playlists, etc. I opened Traktor one day, while having installed absolutely nothing new on my computer from the night before, and it took me through a setup menu you get when you first install. I thought it was odd, but I went along with it. I now use OSX to organize my files. When it was completed, it had erased all of my playlists. You might ask yourself, “why not use History and get it all back?”

That brings me to my next problem.

2. Months and months of no history being kept whatsoever. I called Native Instruments and they had no solution to this problem. Months of playlists, gone forever.

[/B]

Without being too harsh a simple backup of your collection file and settings would’ve saved that one. I do it every month at a minimum.

A lot of it just seems like bad luck though, I’ve never had a single one of those problems… and tbh I’m not exactly careful or pedantic about looking after my stuff.

[Tenova]

@shr3dder

Without being too harsh a simple backup of your collection file and settings would’ve saved that one. I do it every month at a minimum.

A lot of it just seems like bad luck though, I’ve never had a single one of those problems… and tbh I’m not exactly careful or pedantic about looking after my stuff.

That’s true, but software shouldn’t completely wipe those out either. I have Time Machine doing backups now.

[ImNotDedYet]

I feel for you man, but one thing you said raised my eyebrows, especially as an IT guy.

Don’t auto-update software just because there’s a new release. If it ain’t broke, don’t attempt to fix it. I think it started with 2.6.6 of Traktor that the playlists got deleted. I believe they’re resolved that to some extent with 2.6.7, but there are still issues apparently with 2.6.7. I always wait to see what kind of bugs appear before upgrading any software, and I’d think it all the more important to do that if it was software I actually made money with.

As far as the other issues, I’m sorry to hear you’ve had/are having those. I haven’t experienced any of those with my setup, but I’m not Mac OS and have moved on from my S4. But I never had any of those issues with the S4 hardware when I used it regularly. It locked up on me once which required a reboot of both the laptop and S4, but I just do this in my bedroom, er living room. I think the S4 mk1 seems to be a lot more stable than the mk2, but I’m guessing you have an mk1 if you’ve been doing this for as long as you say.

It’s a bummer, but since you rely on this stuff for gigs, you may want to look into another, more reliable setup.

[Tenova]

That’s a really good look. I always assumed newer was better.

What did you move onto and what was the transition like?

[ImNotDedYet]

I would give it a month from release to see what bugs or issues are brought up with any new releases. Software development is a very inexact science, and it’s very difficult to test every scenario with pre-existing functionality.

Since I have turntables now, I still use Traktor Scratch Pro, but got a Pioneer DJM 900 Nexus and do all my mixing externally. I didn’t really feel the build quality of the S4 was good enough to take out and have had friends start asking me to play house parties, etc. as well as a friend asking me to do weddings with him because I did that way back in the day. From a feel perspective, the 900 is a lot more solid than the S4, but I sure do miss all the control over Traktor I had with the S4 regarding loops, cue point jumping and effects. The effects on the Pio are OK, still getting used to them, but not nearly the control of Traktor and the S4. I also mix straight vinyl or DVS only now, (and mostly vinyl at that) so it’s not that big of a deal to me not having jogs, etc, but may wind up getting an X1 at some point for cues/live loops/effects. I also have an F1 I need to use at some point.

Best of luck!

[Stewe]

7. Sometimes I can crash Traktor with a mapping.

[jdownesbaird]

@Stewe

7. Sometimes I can crash Traktor with a mapping.

Your complex mappings can crash the entire internet!

[Karlos_Santos]

@Tenova

It’s become apparent that it’s not the fault of the computer, but of Traktor. I’ve checked my System Diagnostics and it seems as if CoreAudio is crashing, and takes Traktor down with it. I currently have a ticket in with Native Instruments on this one, just sent them a diagnostic and am waiting to hear back.

Surely if its’s a problem with CoreAudio then it’s a problem with the computer, not Traktor.
Did Support ask you to do Extended Logging ?

Where are you in the Support process at the moment..?

@Tenova

1. Complete loss of my entire library, playlists, etc. I opened Traktor one day, while having installed absolutely nothing new on my computer from the night before, and it took me through a setup menu you get when you first install. I thought it was odd, but I went along with it. I now use OSX to organize my files. When it was completed, it had erased all of my playlists. You might ask yourself, “why not use History and get it all back?”

That brings me to my next problem.

2. Months and months of no history being kept whatsoever. I called Native Instruments and they had no solution to this problem. Months of playlists, gone forever.

History or Archive? Your Archive playlists are stored in the (stupidly) name History folder, not to be confused with the History Node which is only a record of your current session and it emptied on closing Traktor. If Traktor is not making history playlists then it is not shutting down properly. This is one of the very very very few issues that can require a full reinstall. Basically 99% of Traktor issues can be resolved without reinstalling. Do you shut Traktor down completely after each session..? You should be in the habit of doing: Traktor Collection>Export Collection (uncheck copy files) and saving a dated copy of the collection.nml in an folder outside of Traktor.

@Tenova

3. Extreme lag effecting audio consistency and causing short dropouts when I don’t restart my computer literally every single time before I play out on it. I know this is standard procedure, but I have an $1800 Macbook Pro that I bought new three months ago, and it still has this issue. There will be times when I’ve been rushed to get on stage and start playing, didn’t restart, and this has ruined sets for me.

Simple thing is to restart. Apple have introduced USB issues in various versions of OS X that require a restart so that audio playback is not stuttered. My brand new MBP needs to be restarted if it’s been on all day with Traktor, iTunes, YouTube, Facebook open. The audio stutters on everything. I’m not convinced that this caused by Traktor. I can gig with Traktor alone for 10 hours (as I did last Saturday) with zero issues with the S4.

@Tenova

4. The entire S4 unit losing functionality, jog wheels not working, and all buttons going completely haywire and not controlling the software entirely. This one boggles my mind still. My S4 worked fine the day prior, when I went to hook it up and practice, it had completely shit itself overnight. Nothing worked. I was under warranty, and it was replaced. It did, however, take weeks for this to happen. I lost a few gigs during this period.

Could have just been a faulty unit or simple breakdown. Do you regularly recalibrate the whole S4.
I would definitely look into getting a backup controller. If you are earning a living it’s a must to have a backup system.

@Tenova

5. RANDOM CRASHES. Traktor WILL, every once in a while, just completely quit itself and an OSX error message will pop up. This has happened numerous times, however, never while DJ’ing. The most recent time when it did this, I had finished a gig 5 minutes prior, and Traktor sent OSX into Kernel Panic, one of the rarest issues to have on a MacBook Pro where the entire operating system is forced to restart for no apparent reason.

Yeah this is not good but, Traktor does not just randomly crash “once in a while”, it just doesn’t unless something causes it like a corrupt file or hardware malfunction. I think your Mac has hardware problems or at least OS X is borked.

@Tenova

…and now, for my current issue.

6. Complete loss of audio/connectivity between laptop and controller while DJ’ing. This is one that I’ve been dealing with for a while now. This has happened to me twice while DJ’ing live. All of my channels in Traktor will, all of the sudden, start crackling and hissing, make a horrible screeching sound, and stop my music entirely. I’ve gone through two different MacBook logic boards as well as a clean install when trying to sort this issue out, and it works for about a month before it begins again.

Going through 2 logic boards is pretty unheard of with recent Macs. I have had logic boards crap out on me but only after a number of years of heavy (HEAVY) use. Did you at any point reinstall Traktor? Did Apple ever tell you what was wrong with the logic boards. Logic boards can burn out if they are allowed to get too hot say, if you are using the Mac on your bed or you don’t put it into standby and put it in a bag.
There must be a link between all the hardware issues you have and Traktor crashing.

@Tenova

Traktor is great software, but these issues are completely ridiculous. Had I known that any of these issues were to arise, I would have never invested time in this software.[/B]

I have a basic setup (on the whole) and I have never had a live crash in 8 years and I gig a LOT more than you between 3 and 6 gigs every week (currently 5)… I am a heavy user and whilst I NEVER treat peoples issues lightly and I am fully aware that people have problems with Traktor and the S4 it would appear that you have had more than your fair share of hardware problems that might be compounding your Traktor issues if not causing them.

The playlist bug was in 2.6.6 and is fixed in 2.6.7.
2.6.6 was the only version of Traktor I have ever rolled back from.

[the_bastet]

another tip with your library. DO MOT USE ITUNES TO MANAGE YOUR MUSIC. Both me and an ex roommate had issues that were fixed simply after stopping use of iTunes.

[no_rex4u]

@ImNotDedYet

Don’t auto-update software just because there’s a new release. If it ain’t broke, don’t attempt to fix it.

This is why i haven’t updated past 2.6.5

[Mr_Moo]

If ever there’s another pc/Mac debate (which seems unlikely..AHEM) I’m going to refer to this post =D

What latency settings do u use in traitor? I used to have an issue with traitor and s4 freezing when using the browse button, but found it to be a conflict with a mapping for the launchpad (j.will). I deleted that and no issues since. My windows laptop runs like a dream.

[Daniboy]

@Mr_Moo

My windows laptop runs like a dream.

hehehe I love windows

[Tenova]

@Karlos_Santos

Surely if its’s a problem with CoreAudio then it’s a problem with the computer, not Traktor.
Did Support ask you to do Extended Logging ?

Where are you in the Support process at the moment..?

As of right now, I’ve sent over my diagnostic reports and I’m waiting to hear back from Traktor. I had my MacBook taken in yesterday and checked out at the Apple store and they ran full system diagnostics and everything appeared to be working. If I can prove that it’s another hardware issue on my Mac, then I’m eligible for a replacement system (three hardware issues under warranty gets you a new system, it’s not public knowledge but it’s how they do it).

Also, what do you mean by extended logging? Where is that option at?

Thanks so much for replying like you have!

[Karlos_Santos]

@Karlos_Santos

I have a basic setup (on the whole) and I have never had a live crash in 8 years and I gig a LOT more than you between 3 and 6 gigs every week (currently 5)

@Mr_Moo

If ever there’s another pc/Mac debate (which seems unlikely..AHEM) I’m going to refer to this post =D

Yeah you should but make sure you also refer to my post above

@Tenova

As of right now, I’ve sent over my diagnostic reports and I’m waiting to hear back from Traktor. I had my MacBook taken in yesterday and checked out at the Apple store and they ran full system diagnostics and everything appeared to be working. If I can prove that it’s another hardware issue on my Mac, then I’m eligible for a replacement system (three hardware issues under warranty gets you a new system, it’s not public knowledge but it’s how they do it).

Also, what do you mean by extended logging? Where is that option at?

Thanks so much for replying like you have!

Traktor produces a Log file and it is updated when you open and close Traktor. When you perform Extended Logging it gives you much more information especially when you have a crash. You need to run a plist editor to change the logging process.
This something that I would expect NI to come back to you with to guide you through the process.

This really is f*cked up and I’m not convinced it’s a wholly Traktor related issue but if it is then let’s get it fixed.
I see you have posted the same thing on the NI forum. I’m a mod on there as well so if you wanna PM me on there with your Support Tickets I can help

You can update me with any information you get from Apple and I can pass it onto NI support if you send me your original Support Ticket.

Keep me in the loop about this.

[bisco]

I’ve been having crash issue with my MBP late 2013 model and tractor. The S4 will completely restart and I’ll have no control over the software and I’m forced to do a hard reboot. This is a huge issue effecting lots of people, I hope it gets sorted quick seeing how I just switch to traktor and S4 about 8 months ago.

[SlayForMoney]

@ImNotDedYet

If it ain’t broke, don’t attempt to fix it.

@no_rex4u

This is why i haven’t updated past 2.6.5

This is why i haven’t updated past 1.2.7 Using it for 3 years - not a single f*** crash or hiccup. And yes, double win partition, optimized.

[frankle]

@Karlos_Santos

This really is f*cked up and I’m not convinced it’s a wholly Traktor related issue but if it is then let’s get it fixed.
I see you have posted the same thing on the NI forum. I’m a mod on there as well so if you wanna PM me on there with your Support Tickets I can help

Tenova, you posted a Core Audio crash screen shot on the NI forum, you’re running 10.8.5 from what I see there, have you tried 10.9.1 at all? I like Karlos don’t think it’s entirely Traktor’s fault … And out of interest, do you have an S4 mk1 or the newer mk2?

On another note, since you seem to play with some big names and such, wouldn’t those places have something like a DJM900NXS and 2 or 3 CDJ2000NXS players? I’ve had no issues when walking into venues with these mixers/players, a few USB leads and a USB hub and you’re away! Maybe something to think about.

Mind you, I’ve had no issues with my S4mk2 or any other NI product I use of late (I have most of them, check signature, plus Z2, TA6 and X1mk1) … and with the latest release of Xone DB2 driver it also works with my MacBook Air so I would say that Traktor 2.6.7 is quite stable.

[Tenova]

@frankle

Tenova, you posted a Core Audio crash screen shot on the NI forum, you’re running 10.8.5 from what I see there, have you tried 10.9.1 at all? I like Karlos don’t think it’s entirely Traktor’s fault … And out of interest, do you have an S4 mk1 or the newer mk2?

On another note, since you seem to play with some big names and such, wouldn’t those places have something like a DJM900NXS and 2 or 3 CDJ2000NXS players? I’ve had no issues when walking into venues with these mixers/players, a few USB leads and a USB hub and you’re away! Maybe something to think about.

Mind you, I’ve had no issues with my S4mk2 or any other NI product I use of late (I have most of them, check signature, plus Z2, TA6 and X1mk1) … and with the latest release of Xone DB2 driver it also works with my MacBook Air so I would say that Traktor 2.6.7 is quite stable.

I haven’t upgraded to Mavericks yet because I was worried about even more issues arising from the upgrade. I have the MK1, but I’ve used the MK2 in the past as well and will be using the MK2 (there’s one at the club) this weekend.

I’ve considered hooking up to those, but I don’t think that the problem lies in my controller to be honest with you. I’d be even more worried about putting excess USB strain on it.

[JZed]

another tip with your library. DO MOT USE ITUNES TO MANAGE YOUR MUSIC. Both me and an ex roommate had issues that were fixed simply after stopping use of iTunes.

Not to mention it’s incredibly slow too. I have identical playlists and folders in iTunes & Traktor, on 2 computers. A bit of OCD there.