Noobie question - When to start playing second song
So I just got a mixer today, and the thing I’ve been having trouble with is starting the second song at the right spot. I am using Virtual DJ and I know when I want the beat drop to happen, I know when I want to mix in the second song, but I don’t know when to start it to get it to drop at the right part. Is there a way I can tell when I need to start a song? Is there a way that virtual DJ displays 8 bar phrases? That would be extremely helpful. For example say I want to put the beat drop on the second song that is loaded (and not playing), but sometimes I start the second song 4 counts too early, so when the first song (the one that is playing) is building up the second song has already dropped.
It will come with practice. You can do it by subtracking the amount of lead time on the second record from the end of the first record. Say your intro is two minutes long on the second record. You subtract two minutes from the end of the first record and start it then. (of course listening to when there is natural place around that time to start the second record is paramount…this is what is called phrasing and song structure.)
After some time you will be able to read the wav forms and recognized how much of what you have left on a track. (breakdown, meat, outro) I’m able to read the grooves on a record and recognize how the song is structured. It all comes with time and practice.
You could cheat and either Start the intros and Drops on cue points or “beatjump” forwards and backwards x bars depending how your phrase is off ..
As keithace said though really just practice and practice to do this without cheating. Know your songs inside out to find the natural mix points that almost every track has.
a good rule of thumb that helped me when learning was to start the next track (the one your mixing in) at around 1m30s remaining for house/electro and around 2m for techno. it will vary from song to song but your ears will tell you exactly when the phrases change.
Learn your music inside and out. Resist the urge to go out and buy/DL as much music as possible. Instead, find 10-15 tracks that you really like, that go well together, and learn those. You should be able to hear the intro ending, hear it end, hear when the breakdown is coming, when a drop etc are supposed to happen, before they happen. Only when you know your music, will you know when to drop your next track.
There is no set rule, you can drop a track and cut over right away, you can drop it and let the outro play through the next tracks intro, play half of one track over the next, there’s many ways to do it.
Don’t try and confine yourself to just one way of bringing the next track in, you will end up uninspired, and you will get bored quick. Experiment with your tunes.
i feel like this advice is actually flawed. you shouldn’t be reading wave forms. you should be learning song structure. its not hard. american and most eastern european song structures fall in 4ths 8ths 16ths and 32nd bars. learn your songs and its not a problem. you should be able to drop a song without looking at wave forms. Of course its great to learn with them, but dont rely on them forever.
i agree
every genre of music has a pattern. between songs it doesnt change that much
If you stay focused on that particular type of music for a bit, youll get it.
The human brain works best with patters. its why we stare at semetrical things longer
and random shapes lesser time. When it comes to our ears, they tell our brains whats going on. so the bottom line is
just listen, carefully
All of this is good advice, although if you want a little bit of a shortcut here is a “cheating” technique I’ve used…
So you know when you want the drop of the second song to come in, right? Listen to the second song and count the number of beats from the beginning of the song until the drop. It’ll probably be a multiple of 32. Then, once you have that number, pull up the waveform for the first song and count that many beats BACK from the point where you want the drop of the second song to hit and drop a cue point there.
This way, when you play the first song, you’ll know to press play on the second song as soon as you see that cue point.
I feel this is also flawed in a sense, whilst it’s definitely fundamental to understand ‘standard’ bar structures, more and more now people are starting to play around with time signatures in electronic music, I’ve seen people use 5/4 and 7/4 and so on, so don’t just keyhole yourself to learning that a ‘general’ electronic song MAY have 32 bars in the intro, that’s silly. Teach yourself a real lesson and learn how count properly and read/ perform all different types of time signatures.
Easiest one is don’t count 1,2,3,4…1,2,3,4…1,2,3,4… because then you dont know what bar your on…lol
the wav forms are a good tool to use as a beginner so you can physically see what you have to work with. NOTHING replaces knowing your tunes. This person is a beginner and asking a very basic question. Why not let him use the the technology to help get him/her started?
thank you for everyone’s advice! I guess I will just have to learn my songs better…I am not using headphones right now so it’s a little more difficult for me to hear when the song is actually coming in. I’ve been doing what Tortanga posted about (counting back from the drop and starting the first song at that point) but I guess with headphones it is a lot easier to hear where you are in the loaded song so you know where to start it, right? I need to get my headphone adapter already lol
Like others have said, learn song structure. Also, listen to your favorite dj mixes. Really listen to their blends. Song structure will become second nature. Sure, some songs are wonky. They’ll have an extra bar before the drop or really long breakdown. Make a mental note of these tunes. The advice abou only playing 15 or so songs is money. You’ll start to hate them, but you’ll learn. Don’t overwhelm yourself with too much music.
I learned this way too. I would use the wave forms in traktor, and try and figure out if a section is 32 beats, and then when i would wanna drop a song, i would go back 32 beats and put a hot cue there so i knew the part was coming. I learned that way… and it was terribly hard and inconvenient… it wasnt until i picked up song structure that i didnt even rely on wave forms.
now my wave forms in traktor are set to the smallest setting cause its a waste of screen space. i barely even look at my screen except to pick a song maybe.
