only a fool would use VDJ!

Off-Topic / Lounge
, ,
21

I reckon Traktor is becoming the new Serato and VDJ is becoming the new Traktor. Not sure what Serato is becoming yet.

What I mean is that Traktor is moving towards being an all in one solution with full plug and play abilities. Perhaps taking it one step further then Serato making their own hardware.
I agree that Traktors native effects are good and there is a lot of fun functions. And being able to map is king. How it’s done not so great. I hate the little controller manager and would much rather learn some simple scripts.

Seems as us users are less intimidated by some code these days and thus opens up for custom mappings of VDJ or MIXXX. The fact that VDJ work with vst plugins and play well with other sofware make it a contender for those who enjoy experimenting and creating their digital setup.

I’m sure Serato has interesting stuff down the line. And I bet many are curious to know. Time will tell I guess. A little sad they just keep pushing stuff like the Bridge for Itch into the future. Think the lack of mapping options is their big downside.

I would love to try VDJ, not to keen to spend the cash though. The new price policy from NI sure shook things up a bit!

Suppose what would be truly epic is if MIXXX would gain enough momentum to be a serious competitor.

Cheers!

22

vst effects and rewire for mixxx and it would be all good!

23

Could you already do that? Use JACK instead of rewire and then just route it into whatever VST host you want. Done.

24

That’s better…

cheap controllers give little discounts, as in if a manufacturer pays less to atomix to option a version of LE to sell the controller cheaper to you, you make up the difference. But I rate NI kontrollers only a little higher than mixtracks and they cost $300, your paying the same for the quality of the controller and $100 for the software, the VDJ equivalent is the mixtrack pro which you pay $150 for the upgrade, but you get lifetime updates, video, timecode and open support for any audio/midi/HID device.

the syntax for scripting is very elegant and as close to the way you would say it as possible. The only things you need to know are variable’s

query ? action if query is true : action if query is false

? means if
: means else

and that ampersand “&” joins scripts together to occur concurrently. eg “do this & do that”

so you can put them together like this

query ? do this & do that : do this & do that

the rest is just using verbs that are easily readable and understandable, you can name all the variables and use as many as you like for really complicated results.

Skinning was a very steep learning curve that took about two days to get over once I tried, although I had a half arsed attempt 6 months prior that I spent a day or two on before giving up. Basically all you need to do is plot where the elements are located and where to draw them and what they do. It honestly takes longer to decide on the final layout, color and drawing then it does to put together a standard skin in xml.

There is also a skin editor that takes the pain out of doing everything manually and checks for any errors. but you are correct xml is unforgiving with simple errors, but is also very good at pointing out the exact location of the error so you can fix it.

Third dodgy 3rd party vst’s can be an issue, but if you use anything live without first testing or have a backup plan your crazy. And you haven’t considered real vst’s that cost money only dodgy free ones, although there are some great free ones.

25

currently i route the audio from each deck out of mixxx using soundflower into ableton for ultimate effects control. mixxx will have effects sometime though, here’s the mixxx effects framework blueprint: http://mixxx.org/wiki/doku.php/effects_framework

scripting in mixxx will also be getting simpler. atm you need to use qtscript (javascript) and have ultimate control, you can even add your own background timers for automated stuff and repeating events etc. point and click midi mapping is already in for 1.11 and hopefully in the future there’ll be a type of traktor-ish modifier system, but no where near as limiting.

here’s the modifier system blueprint that i need to pull my finger out and contribute to: Modifier System · mixxxdj/mixxx Wiki · GitHub so any ideas welcome… :wink:

edit: meant 1.11 and not 1.12 :stuck_out_tongue:

26

i would say that the vdjscript language is about the perfect middlepoint for flexability and usability for non-coders. a lot of users would rather be able to do everything in a gui using modifiers like in traktor tho - so hopefully a more advanced form of modifiers will go into a future version of mixxx and you’ll still be able to combine that with advanced javascripting and also access those same modifiers.

i do like the vdj syntax tho - and the new midimasher config format that is almost ready is very similar - based on the same “ternary operator” syntax (the whole question mark thingy)

27

couldn’t you make a html webform that can take the typing out of scripting in mixxx? although in vdj8 that was being changed to both dropdown menu’s and typing… I prefer typing personally as it’s quicker once you know the language used.

The mixxx blueprint for effects looks fantastic and very well thought out! I like that you can predesignate the order of effect chains in traktor and mixxx, that is something you can’t do in VDJ, you can chain the effects but it gets chained in the order of activation which is a clumsy implementation considering their is designated effect slots built in. I wish it followed the slot order instead..

28

I actually never tried any VST with VDJ because I’m on mac. I’ve also got 2 iPad skins in the downlad section and made my own mapping. But I would guess that maybe 80% of VDJ users will never do any skinning or mapping them self because it requiers you to learn things that have nothing to do with DJ’ing. where as in Traktor it’s just pressing through some drop down menus. You deside that you want that button to enable an FX 3 for clicks and it’s done without even tyrping any script code. But if you wan’t to do some more complex mapping Traktor controll manager can be a limitation.
We use VDJ as karaoke system in our club and it’s perfect for that. I like VDJ for pre listening to large folder and sorting the good songs in a favorite folder then export to import in Traktor on my DJ laptop. VDJ has by far the best browser and prelistening system I’ve every tried. So at home I do use it a lot Traktor just is better for my workflow at my gigs.

29

could be possible in the same way that i’m using the LPEG library to implement my own midimasher scripting format which converts it to LUA. something for mixxx would need to compile to javascript. hopefully the use of advanced modifiers and conditionals in the mixxx gui will be enough for 95% of what people need to do tho. an interesting idea tho… some kind of “scripting helper” may be a good idea for some common stuff that people may want to do but would otherwise require javascript scripting. also once people see that javascript isn’t actually all that hard they wouldn’t even need to use the web form…

it should be cool, especially the effects plugin api, which i guess would be similar to how vdj effects plugins work and the config format which should allow vst’s to be used quite easily. a lot of people on this forum seem to care way too much about effects, so i don’t suppose the general populace here will think too much of it until it has some kind of framework, which is a shame. esp as you can already use some external vst host for effects and route audio to it.

i’m pleased that mixxx made it into the djtt dj survival kit tho :wink:

30

I’m trying to learn javascript now it’s a pain in the arse… still not over the curve but it’s becoming a little easier every day. but when I look at html page sources for some websites or special effects I get a little scared!

31

lol… a good chance they’re using jquery, which is something you should look into. i use jquery and plugins for 99% of the websites i need to write javascript code for. if u see stuff like $(‘#foo’).something() there’s a good chance it’s jquery or possibly prototype.js that i used to use before realising the true awesomeness of jquery…

edit: javascripting in mixxx is generally quite simple though, esp compared to what you usually need for websites, have a look at this example which is used by my djtech cdj101 mapping: http://djism.com/mixxx/DJ-Tech-CDJ-101-scripts.js

32

I haven’t figured out how to use jquery yet, I have tried a couple of codes but can’t get the syntax correct although it’s only been a couple of weeks, and wanted to use loops with opacity for a fade to cut down on page size as the cutdown jquery file is 100kb on it’s own. and with inkscape svg graphics I’m already sitting on 250kb which is already far too large… problem is there are heaps of beginner tutorials I have found but no transitional ones from beginner to intermediate…

33

remember tho that the js file only gets loaded once for the whole website, so each page refresh after that will use the previously loaded jquery file (and all your other js filles, i hardly ever embed js within the html source). also before using jquery/prototype i would find bugs on various browsers and have to put in specific code depending on what browser was being used. we seem to have got way OT again :smiley: feel free to email me if i can help with the js thing. stuff like fades is def easier in jquery tho with stuff like $(‘#foo’).fadeToggle(“slow”, “linear”)

34

That’s cool I only opened this for a laugh and a little education, not nearly enough hate though, maybe I should have put “skrillex” in the title… good to know about jquery only loading once though… Once I’m up to speed I might take you up on your offer, but I’m still a noob so no point explaining things now as I won’t understand them :wink:

35

must admit i was expecting loads of ill-informed anti-vdj comments :stuck_out_tongue: just for the record i actually think some of the stuff by skrillex is bloody good. not usually my cup of tea but have no idea why all the hate… a lot is jealousy i suspect :wink:

36

Skrillex I also like but like him more when I’m on the dancfloor side of the DJ booth :smiley: Dub(Bro)Drum/step and those styles are fun to dance to but but gets boring fast when your sober behind the decks :smiley: those nights I wish I had VDJ and a playlist on automix :stuck_out_tongue:

37

some cool work is currently being done to improve the autodj function in mixxx as it happens :wink: auto beat matching and being able to customize what kind of mixing is used between tracks etc. never (hopefully) going to put us out of a job but i’m interested to see how it turns out… does look like it may be quite cool. i’d like to at least use it to have mixxx auto play tunes i’ve bought for dj’ing as opposed to just using itunes or playing my own mixes: Mixxx - GSOC2012 - AutoDJ Features

38

The thing about VDJ/Mixxx/user sculpted software is that yeah, you could spend days learning scripting and mapping, and have a DJing experience. Or, you could plug in your SL/Traktor Audio card, turn on your CDJs, or plug in your controller, and start doing all of that immediately, like right as soon as they’re on. Whenever I see people wasting countless hours generating massive mappings or scripts to do fundamentally what CDJs and a mixer do already, it makes me wonder what those people actually enjoy doing.

First person to say “flexibility and choice” gets kicked in the head. You don’t realistically need to spend all that time creating a rig that plays two tracks at the same time, and any “performance options” can be filled by opening up Live and actually remixing a track.

39

some people do like the scripting tho ofc and i’m sure synthet1c and stewe are in that camp as well as myself. most people aren’t going to want to create their own mappings no matter how easy or hard i guess, but that’s why there’s plenty of mappings for vdj/mixxx that people can download and just use.

the mapping i created for my cheapo djtech cdj101’s didn’t take long and just gives me nice and manual control over the decks. that’s all i tend to actually use when mixing these days, the rest is just mapping/scripting for the fun of it.

also… if i could afford cdj’s i suspect i wouldn’t even want to use any software most of the time. maybe just manually synching ableton for some extra clips etc.

flexibility and choice. actually i have a headache atm already…

40

But I like mucking about with software :stuck_out_tongue: